Sunday, August 27, 2006

August shorts

You really have to be a sadist to read former UK Defense Minister Michael Portillo's prognosis of military action in Lebanon under French leadership. An excerpt:

We (the other Nato defence ministers) found a word to describe the French habit of making impressive statements with no means to put them into effect. ...

The unclear rules of engagement derive directly from the ambiguity of the French-inspired resolution. But France has nonetheless used the uncertainty as an excuse for delay. ... French forces are now arriving in Lebanon with the mission and the rules still unspecified. ...

At the heart of this mess is France’s reluctance to tackle Hezbollah. ... France’s failures of both diplomacy and nerve have made it less likely that the ceasefire will hold, and made the UN mission more dangerous. ...

Last week a former junior member of the [first] Bush administration, Jeff[d?] Babbin, likened undertaking a military operation without the French to going on a deer shoot without an accordion ... In the case of Lebanon, grandstanding was not enough. He has now stepped forward to do his duty with all the relish of a man slipping into a quicksand ...


Also, Fox News reports that the "two Fox News journalists were released Sunday, nearly two weeks after being seized by militants in Gaza." Reuters had earlier reported that both had suddenly converted to Islam. Video captures of their conversion are shown below below.

 

What are the odds both men have seen this movie?

Ah, ha, ha, ha, stayin alive, stayin alive

332 Comments:

Blogger enscout said...

Conversion to Islam....??

Talk about slipping into quicksand.

8/27/2006 05:24:00 AM  
Blogger Triton'sPolarTiger said...

Ok Wretchard, new keyboard please!

The moment it dawned in my consciousness that the 3rd pic was Travolta from Saturday Night Fever, I was beverage-spewing.

ROFLMBrightAndShinyAO!!

Priceless!!!

8/27/2006 05:47:00 AM  
Blogger RWE said...

Would have been better if they had used a different finger.....

8/27/2006 06:15:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Noah, yes, but as Ralph Stanley sang in "O Brother, Where Art Thou?",

O, Death
O, Death
Won't you spare me over til another year
Well what is this that I can't see
With ice cold hands takin' hold of me
Well I am death, none can excel
I'll open the door to heaven or hell
Whoa, death someone would pray
Could you wait to call me another day
The children prayed, the preacher preached
Time and mercy is out of your reach
I'll fix your feet til you cant walk
I'll lock your jaw til you cant talk
I'll close your eyes so you can't see
This very air, come and go with me
I'm death I come to take the soul
Leave the body and leave it cold
To draw up the flesh off of the frame
Dirt and worm both have a claim
O, Death
O, Death
Won't you spare me over til another year?

8/27/2006 06:39:00 AM  
Blogger RWE said...

By the way, Y'all don't miss this:
http://www.opinionjournal.com/wsj/?id=110008853

The Socialists and the Islamic Facists in Belgium have made common cause?

It all fits.

8/27/2006 06:54:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Both RWE's and the other Sunday article @ Opinion Journal, Shelby Steele's reflections on the current crisis, are rewarding reads.

Mr. Steel's essay, in clear plain English, is an especially good thing for a Sunday email to those of your kith & kin who may have not been paying attention to this war.

8/27/2006 07:20:00 AM  
Blogger Tony said...

The mystery is why the US would ever enter into a "peace agreement" that is partially authored by the French. Has the run-up to OIF already been forgotten, where the French virtually promised Saddam that they would veto whatever the US painstakingly persuaded the UN to do?

Ps. I was away from a while, could somebody please supply a pointer to the new rules that get your posts deleted? Or perhaps google just hates me.

8/27/2006 07:30:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

Palestinians singularly disprove the postulate that every human life has value. Line up the D9s and don't stop until there is a new seawall off the coast where Gaza City used to be.

re: Portillio
Too bad that plain-speaking politicians don't get that way without a "former" in their name.

8/27/2006 07:30:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

"The mystery is why the US would ever enter into a "peace agreement" that is partially authored by the French."
Amen.
Well and good to yuck about the French but WTF?

8/27/2006 07:33:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Boston,
Did you read Trish's link and become convinced we're all suffering from Male Menopausal Hysteria over the "so called" IslamoNazi threat?

8/27/2006 07:35:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

wretchard wrote:

Fox News reports that the "two Fox News journalists were released Sunday, nearly two weeks after being seized by militants in Gaza." Reuters had earlier reported that both had suddenly converted to Islam.

Jill Carroll: Reciting Koranic Verses Kidnapped American Reporter Recalls The Pressure To Convert To Islam

Now expect a book called "How To Convert To Islam And Save Your Life" to be a surprise best-seller from Madrid to Stockholm. I hope the loony left finds what they're looking for when they submit to Allah, but they should be warned it's a one-way ticket. At least in the much-maligned Christian religion, you can miss Mass skip Protestant services on Sunday without getting 70 lashes.

8/27/2006 07:42:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

peterboston wrote:

Palestinians singularly disprove the postulate that every human life has value. Line up the D9s and don't stop until there is a new seawall off the coast where Gaza City used to be.

Krauthammer's idea was to have the Israelis set up five howitzers on their side connected to a radar/computer system that detects when the Pallies launch a rocket. The computer automatically, without human intervention, fires five rounds back on Gaza for every rocket they fire on Israel. Then it becomes a deterrent in the same way a wall implacably deters people from beating their head on it.

8/27/2006 07:49:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Teresita, five-for-one is "disproportionate" -- why not one-for-one?

8/27/2006 07:56:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

"Then it becomes a deterrent in the same way a wall implacably deters people from beating their head on it"
---
Unless they're Palestinians.
Or Liberals.

8/27/2006 08:07:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Larsen,
I have a hard time imagining that thing achieving the muzzle velocity of an M-16, but damn, those Balls!

8/27/2006 08:11:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Larsen's Shelby Steele Link

8/27/2006 08:20:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

8/27/2006 08:27:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

"But the international left is in its own contest with American exceptionalism. It keeps charging Israel and America with oppression hoping to mute American power. And this works in today's world because the oppression script is so familiar and because American power cringes when labeled with sins of the white Western past. Yet whenever the left does this, it makes room for extremism by lending legitimacy to its claim of oppression.

Over and over, white guilt turns the disparity in development between Israel and her neighbors into a case of Western bigotry. This despite the fact that Islamic extremism is the most explicit and dangerous expression of human bigotry since the Nazi era. Israel's historical contradiction, her torture, is to be a Western nation whose efforts to survive trap her in the moral mazes of white guilt. Its national defense will forever be white aggression.

But white guilt's most dangerous suppression is to keep from discussion the most conspicuous reality in the Middle East: that the Islamic world long ago fell out of history. Islamic extremism is the saber-rattling of an inferiority complex.
"

8/27/2006 08:29:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

doug has a s-s-s-t-tuttering keyboard.

8/27/2006 08:31:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

I was feeling guilty.

8/27/2006 08:37:00 AM  
Blogger Papa Ray said...

Jeez, Steele used hundreds of words to get his point across. While many laymen, on the web, have said the same thing in just a small paragraph or two.

Does he get paid by the word?

Papa Ray

8/27/2006 08:39:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion. You just leave a lot of useless noisy baggage behind."
Jed Babbin, former Deputy Undersecretary of Defense
...in the REAGAN administration.

8/27/2006 08:42:00 AM  
Blogger Unknown said...

"But what shall it profit a person if they gain the whole world but lose their soul?"

When should we go quietly into that good night? The Deans, Sheehans, Murthas, Polosies, ANSWERs, etc. of the world say "always, there are no absolute truths."

.. Every writer who supports the GWOT should close with the following, and when the last jihadist is caught and sentenced, the same should be inscribed on the condemnation order...

We stand with Quattrocchi.

8/27/2006 08:42:00 AM  
Blogger NahnCee said...

I simply do not understand the psychology of the dreadful Palestinians, nor of any of the terrorist ilk of al-Queda, et al.

WHAT did they think they were accomplishing by this enforced conversion? Do they understand that what it translates into is that Islam is such an awful religion that no one would embrace it who is in their right mind and not at the barrel of a gun?

Do other Muslims applaud this act, since it *must* reflect on them, too? Do they all understand that, or are the whole bunch of them so shallow and uneducated that they buy into the party line that by forcing people to mouth some words they don't mean, Allah will love them more?

When Jill Carroll was abducted in Iraq, there was great ululating and lamentations among Iraqi bloggers, going on and on and on about what a wonderful female person she is. Since she's been freed and back home and speaking out about what REALLY happened, I haven't seen one single Iraqi blogger mention her name. I guess when she's safe and can speak honestly, she becomes a less-wonderful female person.

8/27/2006 09:02:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Fabrizio Quattrocchi's kidnappers forced him to dig his own grave and kneel beside it wearing a hood as they prepared to film his death, but he defied them by pulling off the hood and shouting "Adesso (or ora) vi faccio vedere come muore un italiano." -- "Now I will show you how an Italian dies." He was then shot in the back of the neck.

The Arabic television station Al Jazeera refused to show the videotape of his death, saying it was "too gruesome". Many commentators have celebrated Quattrocchi's defiance and suggested that he ruined the propaganda value of the video by refusing to submit to his captors.
========
OT, but anybody remember this USN vs Iran scuffle, back in 1988?

8/27/2006 09:05:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

ari tai said:

"But what shall it profit a person if they gain the whole world but lose their soul?"

Quid enim prodest homini si mundum universum lucretur animae vero suae detrimentum patiatur aut quam dabit homo commutationem pro anima sua

Anima means breath. What Jesus really said was, "What good is it for a man to acquire more possessions than anyone in history, and then die?" But since then, the word anima, translated as "soul", has acquired a lot of theological baggage, and now it is an immaterial something you can "save" or sell to the devil. Even with that definition, you end up on an infinite loop when you say you "have" a soul, because the soul is your identity, it is that part of you which has things.

8/27/2006 09:22:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

RWE, guess they have better luck the closer they get to Stockholm?

8/27/2006 09:32:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

nahncee said:


Do they all understand that, or are the whole bunch of them so shallow and uneducated that they buy into the party line that by forcing people to mouth some words they don't mean, Allah will love them more?


Galileo just wanted to tell other people about what he saw in his telescope, he didn't expect the Roman Inquisition. He was required to mouth words declaring the immobility of the sun to be "absurd in philosophy and formally heretical", and the mobility of the earth "to be at least erroneous in faith" So think of Islam as being like Christianity, but in a pre-Enlightenment state.

8/27/2006 09:36:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

So think of Islam as being like Christianity, but in a pre-Enlightenment state.

Any you wonder why you get the loony toons moniker hung on you? Stop painting targets.

Christianity is to Islam as an Italian suasage is to a dog turd.

8/27/2006 09:44:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

8/27/2006 09:53:00 AM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Terestita,

With all respect, this is not quite right:

Anima means breath.

Or only half right. The anima = soul identification is directly analogous to the Greek situation with ψυχή being identified with "soul." In very ancient Greek, in Homer's era, there were a number of words (psyche, thumos, menos, nous) loosely identified with our notion "soul." Psyche (ψυχή) was a sort of "breath soul," as when one "gave up the ghost" (in German Geist, mind, spirit, soul), with a last exhalation some sort of spirit was thought to leave for the underworld (a place not at all like our idea of Heaven, where the souls were not especially happy -- see Pound's first Canto)...

So all these terms are rather vague and have had many shifting meanings over the ages. And by the way, I think you'll recall thhat whatever word Jesus actually used for "soul" in this passage was Aramaic...

And don't forget that Jung (I know, I know!) used the term anima as a word for the feminine part of the soul that we men carry aroun!


;-)


Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 09:55:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

Gosh, pretty soon I'm gonna run out of Belmont Clubbers to talk to.

8/27/2006 09:55:00 AM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Eppur si muove...


Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 09:57:00 AM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

around!

Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 09:59:00 AM  
Blogger Jeff Medcalf said...

Actually, PeterBoston and Rufus, I believe if you read up on the history of the Catholic Church pre-Enlightenment, you will find that there is a strong resemblance to the more militant strains of Islam. Both are expansionist, demand total obedience, demand universal (catholic!) adherence, are warlike, accept the legitimacy of forced conversion, are violently anti-Semitic and many other comparisons besides. It is only with the Enlightenment that the Catholic Church became something a modern Westerner would find admirable.

What we need to do is not criticize people for pointing out truths such as this, which portray our ancestors as something less noble than we in some ways or in some cases. Instead, we need to examine them for lessons, because if we became better because of the Enlightenment, for example, it means that there is a similar possibility in Islam, if we can find the way to unlock it.

Which is a far cry from "loony toons", and more in the way of not forgetting the past, so as to avoid being condemned to repeat it. Converting the Catholics to a relatively harmless church via schism and warfare took more than 100 years.

8/27/2006 10:01:00 AM  
Blogger What is "Occupation" said...

Deja Vu.

Palestinians kidnap westerners, then get all the congrat's when they spring them...

only thing missing was jesse Jackson going over and getting some tv time...

how disgusting, from the LACK of mention of the Israeli soldier that was kidnapped, to the fresh pressed italian suit the prime minister of "batshit-palestine" was wearing, sitting there hold a press conference, listening to the released hostages talking about "palestinian" hospitality and how the "palestinian" story must be told... i wanted to barf.

Here is the story, the Palestinians, tired from shooting their imaginary israeli collaborators, hacking to death any women that has shamed them, or discussing business deals with loaded ak-47's, got bored since their bigger murderous cousins stole the limeline (sorta like the french and italians in lebanon). Now all that happens when these poor misunderstood palestinians shoot kassams is that Israel attacks back! No fun there fur sure....

So they said... Yo Mohammed, let us snatch some new "hostages", and poof! they snatched 2!

But here is the NEW and IMPORVED angle, Let us send a letter and state our demands!

Which name shall we call ourselfs......

Well we cant be Fatah or Hamas since we are in charge now...

how about?

Abu Nidal Organization
Hezbollah
Egyptian Islamic Jihad
Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades
Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine
force 17
Palestinian Islamic Jihad
Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine - General Command
Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine
Al-Qaida

naw, a new group! We can get a new ball cap! let us order them!

Holy Jihad Brigades!

Old Mo would be so proud of our new islamic goosestepping group! the Holy Jihad Brigades..

Listen abdullah, get print shop to print up some NEW and IMPROVED baseball hats, tell all the people that Sunday will be the RED Holy Jihad Brigades hat day, Monday will be the YELLOW Hezbollah, and TUESDAY will be the BLUE HAMAS hat day!

Same disgusting group of terrorists, just different hats.

8/27/2006 10:05:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

jeff medcalf wrote:

What we need to do is not criticize people for pointing out truths such as this, which portray our ancestors as something less noble than we in some ways or in some cases.

Thank you Jeff. Now, where have you been for the last week! :-)

8/27/2006 10:06:00 AM  
Blogger What is "Occupation" said...

poss -

i've been there many times...

could tell you some amazing stories...

8/27/2006 10:18:00 AM  
Blogger What is "Occupation" said...

Jeff, you're right. However, Christianity at it's worst (and it did get pretty bad) was never as bad as Islam; and, I say this as no big fan of religion, period.

Well actually far worse than islam is.

however thank g-d that christian era is gone.

8/27/2006 10:20:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Quoting Homer:
"Ummm BEER!"

8/27/2006 10:31:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

"When Jill Carroll was abducted in Iraq, there was great ululating and lamentations among Iraqi bloggers, going on and on and on about what a wonderful female person she is.
Since she's been freed and back home and speaking out about what REALLY happened, I haven't seen one single Iraqi blogger mention her name.
I guess when she's safe and can speak honestly, she becomes a less-wonderful female person.
"
---
Anybody got the names of a few of those bloggers?

8/27/2006 10:39:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Tater's 10:03:38 AM is right on.
Haven't read references yet.

8/27/2006 10:43:00 AM  
Blogger vanderleun said...

Lenny Bruce: " "I'll give away state secrets -- Caroline Kennedy plays with herself with a bobby pin --just don't give me that hot-lead enema!"

8/27/2006 10:45:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

No wonder she'd turned out Liberal.

8/27/2006 10:50:00 AM  
Blogger 3Case said...

"...-- why not one-for-one?"

Yeah...like I'd like opt be around when that thing fired....

8/27/2006 10:51:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Re "stages" of a religion, the war that gave us the "Westphalian model" that is suddenly, stupifyingly, no longer relevant:
(edited for brevity)

Magdeburg had a population of thirty thousand, almost completely Protestant. After the a six month siege the Catholic forces managed, on May 20th 1631, to over-run the city. The description of the carnage by Brain Bailey, from his excellent book Massacres:

The enraged Catholic League troops then set about annihilating Magdeburg...Children were thrown into flames and women were raped before being butchered. Fifty-three women were beheaded in a church. No one was spared, regardless of age or sex, and twenty-five thousand of the city’s population were either massacred or burnt to death...[Count von] Tilly [1559-1632; commander of the Catholic forces] held a solemn mass in the cathedral [of Magdeburg] and boasted that no such great victory had occurred since the destruction of Jerusalem. The loss of life in this war was tremendous. It reduced the population of Germany, according to conservative estimates by at least a third; this put the death toll...as high as fourteen million. Peace was finally negotiated in Westphalia in 1648. The positive contribution of this peace was that it finally secularized the western politicians. After this, the pope no longer wielded the secular power that his predecessors had enjoyed. The power of the religion to do harm was reduced tremendously.

8/27/2006 11:01:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

"We have no indication at all that this has anything to do with terrorism," said Laura Brown, an FAA spokeswoman."

Recordings of Frantic Cellphone Calls from passengers prior to takeoff screaming:

"There's Two *Asians* wearing Tubans at the controls!"

Have been impounded by the DOE.

8/27/2006 11:07:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Tubans? No wonder they sent them to the DOE.

8/27/2006 11:11:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Doug--is there a real report?

8/27/2006 11:20:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

The first responders pull the Exec officer from the cockpit, buddy.
Doubt that he was wearing a tuban or a turban, for that matter.

Looks like they may have used the wrong runway, but first reports should be discounted until confirmed.

8/27/2006 11:23:00 AM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

The thing to keep in mind about this sort of coerced conversion to Islam is that once one has joined the faith, to later renounce that faith is to become

APOSTATE.

The penalties for the faithful attempting to leave Islam are much harsher than for the infidel.

I would imagine that many clerics over the centuries have issued fatwas declaring it the religious duty of ANY devout Muslim to kill the apostate wherever they find them.

Remember the fatwa issued against Salman Rushdie by the Ayutollah Ruhollah Khomeini, for having offended Islam with his "Satanic Verses?"

Sharia (Islamic Law) may in civil cases acknowledge the unenforceability of coerced contracts, but I'll guarantee that Sharia does not accept that as exemption from punishment for apostasy.

So, having coerced the two newsmen to convert to Islam, if those two later publicly renounce their conversion, and are subsequently murdered by some completely OTHER Islamic M-F, the original kidnappers are free of any blame, at least under Western Law.

I watched Wesley Snipes in "Passenger 57" last night. Apart from the merits or demerits of the movie, it was aggravating more than I have words to describe, just seeing how accurately it portrays the self-mutilating hobbles the West places on itself.

We've grown up since WWII watching a hundred thousand movies (written, directed, and acted by a crowd of Hollywood Liberals mostly) glorifying some insane "Code of the West" by which honor is maintained ONLY by allowing your adversary to draw first blood.

"I'm not even going to START for my gun until I feel my worthy opponents round slam into my shoulder..."

How many times have you seen two, then five, then twelve police officers pile onto a citizen resisting arrest? Invariably some ASS HOLE bystander will say, "Wull, Gee! THAT's not fair!" as though we should rightly require our constabulary to give a suspect even odds of getting away.



In the spring of 1987 a young man in Cincinnati who had been a patient in a mental hospital was allowed to visit his parents for the weekend. Sunday afternoon came, and he did not want to return to the hospital. Locked himself in the bathroom with a kitchen knife. After a few hours of pleading failed to persuade him to emerge, his parents called the police. The call was taken by a young cop in his first year — a “rookie.”
When that police officer arrived, the young man came out of the bathroom, still carrying the knife, and approached the officer. When the guy continued advancing, still with the knife in his hand, despite the officer’s orders to drop it and halt, the officer drew his weapon and fired. Sadly, the young man died of the gsw.

That was (and *is*) standard police procedure, though, even though it might be true that a more experienced officer MIGHT have been able to handle things differently. Many people have been killed by even itty-bitty knives. Some departments have issued standing rules authorizing lethal force if a suspect with a knife approaches as close as six feet.

The next day a bunch of students were talking about this, and several of them insisted — I am not making this up — that the police officer should have shot the knife out of his hand.

We have a very long way to go in getting folks to wake up to reality.

8/27/2006 11:32:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

rufus

I agreed with Peter in his statement: Why keep painting bullseyes?"

Et tu, rufus?

8/27/2006 11:35:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Now if they could gaurantee we'd all end of with Clones of Rushdie's wife, they'd start making some progress.

8/27/2006 11:41:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

The Mad Fiddler

The next day a bunch of students were talking about this, and several of them insisted — I am not making this up — that the police officer should have shot the knife out of his hand.

I was taught, "Three disabling rounds, center of mass."

"Gosh, that's going to kill him, ain't it?"

"Three disabling rounds, center of mass."

"Think about his wife and kids. How are they going to feel?"

"Three disabling rounds, center of mass."

"Shouldn't you try to hit his legs or something? You don't want the death of another human being on your conscience, do you?"

"Three disabling rounds, center of mass."

8/27/2006 11:42:00 AM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

So, Teresita, have you some law enforcement training / experience in your background?

Should give some perspective.

Apart from people pissing each other off... no, that's not right. Apart from people Getting pissed off over some ascii characters... hmmm...

Sorta seems like part of the problem here is that we have a very restrictive medium of communication, and it's gonna take a fair amount of time to sort things out.

Poop. I guess all I can say is I'm glad folks are still participating. The most important thing here is that our differences may be real, but they should matter far less than the community we are trying to build with our bitty little posts and comments.

We all gotta vent.

Sometimes I just don't hit the "Login and Publish" button.

The advantage of this is it gives me even more time to think of some even more devastating insult, that will establish *ME* as the Avenging Jihadi Commentator...

8/27/2006 12:18:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

A Guy’s gotta Vent
A Woman’s gotta vent
All God’s Chirren gotta vent
But who struck John and thar she went
Sometimes the pissypost’s best unsent

8/27/2006 12:28:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Ha--nice scherzo, there, fiddler--

8/27/2006 12:28:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

My nurse just brought my meds

I’ll lie down till the posting urge goes away

8/27/2006 12:29:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

Up the stream of consciousness


without so much as a paddle

8/27/2006 12:31:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Up the stream of consciousness

without so much as a paddle

he writes to right this awful mess

and ends up in an addle.

8/27/2006 12:40:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

12:14:54 PM Habu,
My first was definitive, and in truth, nothing more needed to be said by anyone since.
I just thought I'd do y'all a favor and try to keep you entertained.

8/27/2006 12:45:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

Hey, is there a modern-day George and Ira?

The first Blog Musical

PaJaMa & PapaJama
pecking at their keyboards
all the cold night thru

Tanned to a crisp
by the light of the CRT

Projected text in the deathless style
of Speilberg annoints their countenances

'member the raptor in Drastic Park?
magical screens that glow in the dark...

Libretto by Wretchard

ooops. time for more caffeine.

8/27/2006 12:54:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

(I know, George & Ira were BROTHERS)

8/27/2006 12:56:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Add a little Sudafed.
---
BLAIR DERANGEMENT SYNDROME
Compliant and subservient:
Jimmy Carter's explosive critique of Tony Blair

(John Preston and Melissa Kite, The Telegraph, August 27th, 2006)
Tony Blair's lack of leadership and timid subservience to George W Bush lie behind the ongoing crisis in Iraq and the worldwide threat of terrorism, according to the former American president Jimmy Carter. Brothers Judd

8/27/2006 12:57:00 PM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

jeff medcalf

The Enlightenment happened about 1,700 years after Catholicism began so I think it a stretch to say that no Westerner could find anything admirable for those first 17 centuries.

If you want to attribute behavior to ideology, religious or otherwise, you should be able to point to the Canon of that ideology and say "See, there it is. Catholics believe that and that's why Catholics act that way."

Now, I can do a "see that" hundreds of times in the Koran and from Mohammed's biography to connect depraved behavior and canonical ideology. Can you do even one "see that" with Catholic Canon? I'm not the final expert on such matters, but I cannot.

8/27/2006 12:59:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Bennet has something like:
Religions are as religions do or something a little more poetic.
---
Timothy McVeigh! Timothy McVeigh! Timothy McVeigh! Timothy McVeigh! Timothy McVeigh! Timothy McVeigh! Timothy McVeigh! Timothy McVeigh! Timothy McVeigh!
Attaboy, Sport.

8/27/2006 01:06:00 PM  
Blogger just a marine said...

Another August short:

I received the following from a post to my own blog and RCP.

Ahmedinajad said...
ISLAM IS THE RELIGION OF ABRAHAM, MOSES, JESUS AND MUHAMMAD (PEACE BE UPON THEM ALL). WAKE UP FEAR THE GOD OF ISRAEL AND THE UNIVERSE. AS A WESTENER THE RATE OF ISLAMS INFLUENCE IS SKY ROCKETING ESPECIALLY IN EUROPE. SO STOP BURYING YOUR HEADS IN THE SAND (no pun intended) LIKE OSTRICHES.

Visit the following websites for further information on ISLAM.

http://www.islamicity.com/Mosque/Muhammad_Bible.HTM
(MUHAMMAD IN THE BIBLE)
http://bible.islamicweb.com/
http://news.sky.com/skynews/video/videoplayer/0,,31200-galloway_060806,00.html
http://ifamericansknew.com/
http://www.witness-pioneer.org/vil/Books/MB_BQS/default.htm (Quran and Science)
http://www.harunyahya.com/
http://www.barnabas.net/
http://www.answering-christianity.com/ac.htm
http://www.islamicity.com/
http://www.islamonline.net/english/index.shtml
http://www.islamalways.com/

While I do not know the individual doing the post, at least I (and we) have a reading list to listen to and study. I am reading all of it.

Here is the original post that prompted the response:

Protecting a basic human right…my life
Now I have had to think about Islam and me

Like most, I continue to do my homework on Islam and what I thought was its cause against the west.

Now I am coming to think the attack on the cultural west is led and financed by less than a 1,000 humans. These 1,000, probably more like 200 to 300 leaders, are a cabal of religious zealots (some already dead) and select family tribal financiers using their oil powered dollars to protect themselves as they try to finance our destruction.

I also am coming to think that the majority of our small cabal of enemies are Sunni Moslems (95% of Islam). The Iranians tend to be Shiite Moslems (5% of Islam), and often distract us as to figuring out who our enemies are.

The Iranian theocracy and president are part time players. Even then, we must respect them for their efforts, and the probable three nukes they bought in autumn 1991 from Nursultan Nazarbayev, the president of Khazakhstan.

That Russia belongs to the eastern world is part of history as it covered up all this Khazakhstan episode. That it still influences some of these now Iranian possible nukes is the problem of the present Russian leaders. Who really knows in the west? And I did not fall off the turnip truck yesterday.

I also have come to believe the vast majority of young Islamic martyrs are created by the horrible failure of a civilization and culture called Islam. Nothing in the West to date has changed this state of failure. In my poor analogy of east and west, lack of upward mobility and opportunity for young people is like being in the military when you know you will probably be dead in the near future. Then I will do some crazy and wild things. (Of course this is theoretical since my times in the Marines never placed me in such a mental state, and I was not in the 8th Air Force or the Kriegsmarine’s U-boats in WWII).

Rather than use my words about the failure of Islam as a civilization and tribe, I offer three links for those who want to read other opinions.
One is by the UN and is written by Arabs: http://www.meforum.org/article/513
The second is by an Israeli academic: http://samvak.tripod.com/brief-middleeast01.html
The third is by a columnist I like: http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/arabs_last_chance_opedcolumnists_ralph_peters.htm

I have also come to believe the cabal of our enemies is concentrated in Arab lands, Pakistan, and “old” Europe. Even the Iranian element is dominated by Arabs, not Persians.

That there are Islamic cells in other countries such as the Philippines (Moro) and Indonesia is a reflection of their more local frictions. But in my homework on finding enemy locations, the cabal is not there.

That the Arab world’s young people are so ripped off by its religious despots, dictators, and the royal families who keep most of the oil cash is their shame.

Our shame is the strong presence in the west of yellow journalism, propaganda, parachute journalism, and the embarrassing gullibility of dealing with deceit.

Here is the fault line to attack…Never have so many been threatened and attacked by a cabal of so few.

The terrorist mass attacks on civilians is statistically small, but huge in its impacts on our way of life, and our own politics, and our finances.

Before we attack, consider this.

Time is on our side. Most opponents are losers (as in small despots, criminals, ideologues , and anarchists). Strategies to exploit their weaknesses will save us a lot of effort, money, and distraction. This assumes our leaders are savvy enough. And the relatively recent oil income of theirs will eventually fade away, in decades.

Time is on our side another way. The traditional western media outlets are collapsing of their own weight. As more locals read news by outsiders who report nothing like what is going on or thought, then the locals will find other sources of “just the news”.

Our western culture idea of nation states has been so abused by tribal and criminal elements that new control of many small nation states will be change for the better of the west.

War 101. The Powell doctrine is always appropriate. To me it appears in our national interest to protect our way of life, and so to commit to such an effort is a good deal.

We must attack and hopefully quickly eliminate most of the cabal that plots our demise. They are not our moral equals. This is a military attack, not a legal attack. This is not assassination, this is war. President Jefferson did it against the Barbary Pirates, and we can do it again.

Expect the normal hand wringing by those ideologically opposed to our way of life, or the military approach.

I expect the attack to be: quick, timed, probably from the air and space and undercover, deadly to the 200 to 300 targeted people, fraught with mistakes by us (mostly in strategic intelligence) , and subject to later counter attack.

In “old” Europe, whether the cabal types have accidents, go to the dungeons, or are tried by local standards that truly take them out of the game, is a wash to me. Mission first.

And the vacuum created by such an attack will unleash monumental forces of Islamic young people that will result in many small wars (a strategic goal of OBL), but almost all to the west’s advantages as the yoke of Islam’s failures are replaced by still volatile nation states with more western exposures. That such movements can be manipulated by those cabal follow-on types is part of how we fight this war.

Don’t be surprised if other local frictions become physical, as in internal-China, China-Taiwan, North Korea-Japan, Japan going nuclear, and Kashmir. After all, WWI prompted a revolution in Russia.

I think change is good. It’s getting there that is difficult.

I do hope Iraq becomes three countries, that Kurdistan and Baluchistan become countries, and generally things become more tribal. Having served in Turkey (an ally), most there would disagree with me about the Kurds. Maybe they are right.

And maybe just giving things almost infinite time will allow things to somehow sort out. Maybe the vast Muslim populations will take out this cabal. Maybe we can pay tribute as did President Jefferson’s predecessors.

8/27/2006 01:10:00 PM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

It's difficult to picture Jimmy Carter and not see the real Manchurian Candidate. I was around during the Carter years and knew then that he saw that his main purpose in life was to knock down the United States. I can easily conjure the flashbacks of contrasting Kennedy's "we will do it not because it is easy but because it is hard" with Carter's "Americans have to accept less."

I don't think it coincidental that the term "zero sum' became popular during the Carter years. He never saw the USA as the engine that could lift the standard of living for people everywhere. He has always has wanted to take the engine apart and distribute its pieces. If there is ever a Milleneium Useful Idiot Award Jimmy Carter is a lock.

8/27/2006 01:18:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

"Some of you people here are really shameless."
---
That does seem like the simplest, most likely, explanation.

8/27/2006 01:19:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

After the Nixon Funeral, A Malaise settled over the Peanut Farm, and Roselyn laid down the law:

"Jimmah! You put down that hammer and bring me back a Nobel Prize.
The rest as they say...
"

8/27/2006 01:24:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

Thanks, Buddy Larsen for the link to the article describing the 1988 USNavy engagement in the Persian Gulf, especially Operation Praying Mantis.

I had thought I was paying attention to the news at the time, but there are aspects of that period I’d never heard of before. I honestly don’t recall anything in the news about this battle, which is described as the largest naval surface-warfare battle since WWII.

For anyone else innarested, here are some URLs:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Praying_Mantis
http://www.nightstalkers.com/history/4.html

http://www.navybook.com/nohigherhonor/pic-iranajr.shtml

http://www.navybook.com/nohigherhonor/vid-prayingmantis.shtml

Makes me think we might have hope after all...

8/27/2006 01:30:00 PM  
Blogger Teresita said...

the mad fiddler said:

Sorta seems like part of the problem here is that we have a very restrictive medium of communication, and it's gonna take a fair amount of time to sort things out.

I agree. I'm fairly new here, so I'm still figuring out who restricts their repartee to the playground of ideas, and who restricts their ideas to playground repartee. Things will smooth out by and by, after I decimate.

8/27/2006 01:44:00 PM  
Blogger Teresita said...

bobalharb said:

Jesus was pointing at something, not himself, but immediately began to be taken for that which he was pointing at, like mistaking the finger pointing at the moon, for the moon it's pointing at. Troubles sprouted like weeds thereafter.

"What did you think the vittles was for?"

"For a dog."

"So 'd I. Well, it wasn't for a dog."

"Why?"

"Because part of it was watermelon."

"So it was -- I noticed it. Well, it does beat all that I never thought about a dog not eating water- melon. It shows how a body can see and don't see at the same time."

8/27/2006 01:50:00 PM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Teresita,

Things will smooth out by and by, after I decimate.

I don't follow you here.

(A serious, honest query.)

Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 01:51:00 PM  
Blogger Kinuachdrach said...

Re: "Just a Marine" 01:10:36 PM

Good post! Well thought out, and thought-provoking.

Surely the real issue is not with the Muslims or Arabs -- it is the dissension within the west. One trivial example -- one of the London Sundays had an article asserting that most Brits do not like any of their political parties, and a substantial percentage are thinking about leaving the country. Does not sound like a country ready to take serious steps to insure its own survival.

Another example: considering mere technology & resources, the US could wean itself off imported oil within a decade or so -- but the US people would have to be prepared to disrupt the habit of a few snail darters, build a bunch of nuclear power plants, and strip mine a lot of oil shale -- which would first mean building a new infrastructure of heavy industry. So far, the will is not there.

The real future conflict could well be the one *within* the west: liberal elites, bureaucrats, & academics versus the rest. And a west weakened by internal dissent could provide tempting opportunities for a China or a Russia -- to say nothing of Islamo-fascists.

The underlying message seems to be -- let's enjoy life while we can; our world is going to become steadily more "interesting".

8/27/2006 01:51:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

Thanks to "Just a Marine"

Magnificent post.

Thanks for the research, and for having faith in us to take the time to absorb and act.

Sometimes venting on these blogs seems a waste of energy, but I think they have a several good effects, all of which flow from planting little seeds and scattering them to the winds. Individually our efforts may seem trivial. But they accumulate, like the individual cells in a root that in time can crack stone and heave it aside.

It's kinda like studying and studying and reviewing and checking with the neighbors to see if you've missed anything so you'll know which way you should vote on whether to build a new hospital or a school or a nuclear power plant.

I'll be studying your links for a while, and will shut up shutting up.

8/27/2006 01:51:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

BurmaBobalharb

8/27/2006 01:55:00 PM  
Blogger Teresita said...

just a marine

Maybe the vast Muslim populations will take out this cabal. Maybe we can pay tribute as did President Jefferson’s predecessors.

Ahmedinajad says he will destroy Israel and Middle East light sweet crude posts 2 dollars higher overnight. How is this not already tribute?

8/27/2006 02:02:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Maybe this will help, Jamie

8/27/2006 02:03:00 PM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Fiddler,

Individually our efforts may seem trivial. But they accumulate...


Gutta cavat lapidem, non vi, sed saepe cadendo...


;-)


Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 02:07:00 PM  
Blogger NahnCee said...

Doug, two of the Iraqi bloggers who commented on Jill Carroll when she was first abducted were: 24Steps to Liberty at http://twentyfourstepstoliberty.blogspot.com/, and Treasure of Baghdad here http://baghdadtreasure.blogspot.com/

* * *

OT sorta/kinda - Australia and Indonesia have been playing tit for tat games the last year or so with Indonesia busting Australians who they claim are drug mules, and then Australia being appalled at the harsh sentences meted out as well as questions about whether or not the Australians were set up, presumably to wring concessions and/or bribes out of them to avoid the stiff jail sentences they've been receiving.

At least one of the Australian women was reported to have converted to Islam while she was in jail. She was photographed in the hijab and the rest of the cloak-like garments. After she was repatriated, she said that she did it to avoid being raped by the native jailers, that once she donned the hijab and announced she was Muslim, they left her alone. I don't believe there have been any repercussions about her denouncing her enforced conversion.

Wonder what it would take to get some Saudi sheikh to issue a fatwa that if you convert at the end of a gun or to avoid being raped, it doesn't count.

8/27/2006 02:07:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Thanks.

8/27/2006 02:10:00 PM  
Blogger Teresita said...

Kinuachdrach said:

Another example: considering mere technology & resources, the US could wean itself off imported oil within a decade or so -- but the US people would have to be prepared to disrupt the habit of a few snail darters, build a bunch of nuclear power plants, and strip mine a lot of oil shale -- which would first mean building a new infrastructure of heavy industry. So far, the will is not there.

Oh there's a lot of bitching and moaning because we're on the top of a spike right now, but soon enough it will fall back into the grass and we'll be spoiled again.

8/27/2006 02:12:00 PM  
Blogger Teresita said...

The mad fiddler said:

Sometimes venting on these blogs seems a waste of energy, but I think they have a several good effects, all of which flow from planting little seeds and scattering them to the winds.

I myself read this blog for many moons before getting a blogger account and weighing in. The ideas kicked around here go out into the marketplace of ideas and roll around for a while and might even influence public policy. It's a Third Millenium version of the Greeks standing in the agora letting fly with their jibber-jabber.

8/27/2006 02:16:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

"and might even influence public policy."
---
Federal Govt Mandates Lithium in Drinking Water.

8/27/2006 02:19:00 PM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Doug,

Federal Govt Mandates Lithium in Drinking Water

The euthymic among us might protest that...

Also, very difficult to control the levels, due to the wide variation in drinking habits...


;-)


Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 02:45:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

I'm OK, You're OK, Nasrallah is A-OK

8/27/2006 02:52:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

(Berne)

8/27/2006 02:54:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Whit,
It's another new Google "Feature"
In Olden Tymes, you could search for comments and it worked perfectly.

Rumor is, they wanted to censor Tony.
I hope Wretchard will put the search bar back on the blog so we can at least search for blog titles.

8/27/2006 03:11:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Turns out, they wanted to censor Whit.

8/27/2006 03:11:00 PM  
Blogger Tony said...

Okay, all you* suddenly morally superior peace lovers / international military stragegy experts: please explain how the policy of ignoring our enemies’ declarations and acts of war is a good idea, based on the precedent of American policy during the 90’s that followed that exact model. Tell us how ignoring our embassies being bombed, our warship the USS COLE being attacked, and even treating the original bombing of the World Trade Center as purely a “law enforcement matter” was sensible policy, and therefore why we should return to such policy.

Lay it on us – you have the perfect example with Iran, who is ignoring the UN Security Council venue where we have taken the grievance, just like Saddam did. Here’s an example for you to tell us how it should be done. Here we are trying to stop another known, active, historic enemy from acquiring WMD’s in 2006, it’s a perfect analogy for Iraq in 2003. Tell us how you will solve this current situation, the way that dumb ol’ Bushie should have solved Iraq.

* not you personally, silly!

8/27/2006 03:20:00 PM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Way, way OT:

Tiger Woods and Stewart Cink in a terrific hole by hole playoff, Bridgestone Invitational...

(I'm partial to Tiger as he's a Stanford classmate of my oldest son...)


;-)

Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 03:27:00 PM  
Blogger Teresita said...

tony said:

Here we are trying to stop another known, active, historic enemy from acquiring WMD’s in 2006, it’s a perfect analogy for Iraq in 2003. Tell us how you will solve this current situation, the way that dumb ol’ Bushie should have solved Iraq.


Walk away. We've had historic enemies who acquired WMDs before (USSR, China) and as soon as they got their nuclear mojo they found out it's only good for retaliation and you can't go swinging the thing around. Have the President give a State of the Union address outlining a doctrine that says the first use of nuclear weapons by any rogue state, no matter how limited the attack (or whether the attack was with a dud), will automatically result in the disproportionate and total annihilation of that state's military and industrial capability.

Then go back to your regularly scheduled programming.

8/27/2006 03:30:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

It's the way of the Tao,
Tony.
Trust Us.
(and abracadabra)

8/27/2006 03:40:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

In fact, you might try SAYING
abracadabra a few times every morning.
Couldn't Hurt.

8/27/2006 03:41:00 PM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Rich,

That's a geat analysis...



Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 03:49:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Careful, Tater might take a bite.

8/27/2006 03:50:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Tater likes his veggies.

8/27/2006 03:52:00 PM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Whit,

You're very kind.

But I'm just a country doctor, and a very ordinary person.

Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 03:52:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Whit, green skin remedy--be "warm-blooded". And give live birth (no egg-laying). Ovoviviparousity'll green ya up every time!

8/27/2006 03:55:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Doc,
Do you practice regular medicine, psychiatry, or both?

8/27/2006 03:56:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Whit, this'll really make ya jealous--dude's a good poet, too!

8/27/2006 04:00:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Tater:
If you'll talk English,
I'll talk Tractor.

8/27/2006 04:00:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Larsen,
Just give me the quantity of production!
Any quality is OK.

8/27/2006 04:04:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Last night I learned two new rules about cascading stylesheets.
Pretty impressive, huh?
Now if I could make it rhyme.

8/27/2006 04:05:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Why can't he cure Islamophobia?

8/27/2006 04:08:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Maybe Cedarford is right.

8/27/2006 04:09:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Now if I could make it rhyme

Of stylesheets Doug learned to cascade,

and now he won't quit, I'm afraid.

8/27/2006 04:10:00 PM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Whit,

Ignore Buddy Larsen.

I paid him $1,000.00 in genuine North Korean counterfeit US "supernotes" for that compliment.

Jamie Irons


Doug,

I'm a general adult psychiatrist, originally a family practitioner (mostly on the Navajo Indian reservation), and most of my work is in consulting with internists, surgeons, and other "real doctors" on psychiatric aspects of their patients' problems.

Jamie Irons

8/27/2006 04:14:00 PM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Actually, Buddy and I are each other's "sock puppets."

Oldest Internet scam in the books.

We pay each other in genuine North Korean (when we can't get those, genuine Hezbullard) counterfeit $100 "supernotes" to say nice things about each other.

That darn Buddy, though, his fees keep going up. The Hezbullard and NoKo counterfeiters can hardly keep up with the demand.

Jamie Irons

(Now I will, finally, shut up. I've gone way, way over the two-post limit.)

8/27/2006 04:22:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

I looked at the courses required for psychiatry and decided maybe I'll tackle that in the next incarnation.

8/27/2006 04:22:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

04:22:01 PM That only counts on the first 50-100.
The Commutariat has spoken.

8/27/2006 04:24:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Tater,
What if we add flaming accidents?

8/27/2006 04:25:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

If there's one thing I can't stand,
it's Pretentious Possums.

8/27/2006 04:26:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Crap! Reality Sucks, Whit.
Why'd you say that?

8/27/2006 04:28:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

If he weren't so Pretentious,
that Possum mighta learned a little
humility perusing the Good Docs works.
Oh well.

8/27/2006 04:30:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

From th' highlands there came an old Scot

who ended up in the islands, a sot.

posts comments like mad,
they're invariably bad,

'cause a George Bush supporter he's not.

8/27/2006 04:31:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Okay, that was cruel. But you axed for production, quality unimportant! How many things rhyme with 'scot' anyhoo? Give me a minute and I'll do an atonement limerick.

8/27/2006 04:38:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Depends on yer perspective:
That last line about absolved me of all guilt by my reckoning.
Thanks!

8/27/2006 04:40:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

I mean I'm not here to impress the Kool Aid Drinkers!

8/27/2006 04:41:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Oh, please, forgive me I've sinned,

A malicious bad limerick I've penned--

I meant not to hurt
(it was only a blurt),

but into this thread does not blend.

8/27/2006 04:43:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Tater keeps trying to boost himself out of this holding orbit, but our magnificent gravity always pulls him back.

8/27/2006 04:45:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Sunday is unblended thread day.

8/27/2006 04:46:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

I guess I'm overdrawing my NoKo fake dollar account. No amount of cabbage can cover the stink I'm makin.

8/27/2006 04:46:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Please address Possum before you go:
Either convince him to stay,
or show me away.
(out)

8/27/2006 04:50:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Links like that make checking back often worthwhile for me.
Thanks, Rufus.

8/27/2006 05:20:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Nazrollah's "admission" -- isn't it just more of the "disproportionate" agitprop operation?

8/27/2006 05:27:00 PM  
Blogger Coach Mark said...

Audio interview with Lt. Col. Buzz Patterson is now up at

http://regimeofterror.com/archives/2006/08/interview_with_lt_col_buzz_pat/

for those who are interested.

8/27/2006 05:28:00 PM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

mark, the link no workee--

8/27/2006 05:37:00 PM  
Blogger Jamie Irons said...

Rufus,

Very good link.

I'm quite fond of Captain Ed.


Jamie Irons

(Doug gave me a dispensation to comment.)

;-)

8/27/2006 05:54:00 PM  
Blogger Kinuachdrach said...

Teresita wrote:
"Have the President give a State of the Union address outlining a doctrine that says the first use of nuclear weapons by any rogue state, no matter how limited the attack (or whether the attack was with a dud), will automatically result in the disproportionate and total annihilation of that state's military and industrial capability."

OK - but that brings us back to Wretchard's recurrent underlying question: How far would we go?

Say there is a nuclear fissle in San Francisco -- some radiation dispersed, Gay Pride Parade interrupted, no serious harm. Does anyone think that the US would nuke one or more countries in response?

Say there is a genuine, albeit small, nuclear explosion -- but the damage is confined to Oakland. What then?

Say there has been an election since the previous President made that speech. Will the new Administration feel compelled to implement the prior Administration's threat?

Don't get me wrong -- I like the idea. But making it credible would require a whole lot more testosterone and a whole lot more common purpose than has been apparent in US politics of late.

Actually, I would like to take your idea a step further -- if there is a nuclear explosion anywhere in the world on the territory of the US or one of its allies, then North Korea, Iran, & Pakistan cease to exist -- no effort to restrict damage only to military & industrial capacity. If any of those parties don't like being on that list, follow Libya's example. Instead of Mutual Assured Destruction, it is Unilateral Assured Destruction. And, by the way, the US will henceforth observe the Anti-Powell doctrine -- we break it, you fix it; fix it wrong, and we will break it again.

But any declarations would be pointless unless the people it was intended to influence really truly believed that the US would reliably implement it. And that just is not the case these days.

8/27/2006 06:02:00 PM  
Blogger Teresita said...

kinuauchdrach wrote:

Say there is a nuclear fissle in San Francisco -- some radiation dispersed, Gay Pride Parade interrupted, no serious harm. Does anyone think that the US would nuke one or more countries in response?

Simple, here is part two of the doctrine: All declared nuclear states not in good standing with the international atomic energy agency are responsible for the detonation of errant devices. In other words, if a terrorist lights off a nuke, it will be exactly equivalent to Iran and North Korea (and maybe Venezuela if they wanna join that club) both lighting one off. This gets Israel off the hook--they are not declared.

8/27/2006 06:19:00 PM  
Blogger Kinuachdrach said...

Teresita wrote:
"Simple, here is part two of the doctrine: All declared nuclear states not in good standing with the international atomic energy agency are responsible for the detonation of errant devices."

OK -- but we still have to address Wretchard's question, and more. How would we make sure that the Bad Guys really believed that the US would follow through on any declaration?

There are probably two prerequisites.

First, near unanimity in the US. All major political candidates, parties, organizations are explicitly & loudly committed to the declaration. Those entities that are not (e.g., Daily Kos, New York Times, BBC, UN) are laughingstocks within the US.

Second, a demonstration. Say, a single submarine-launched ICBM with a dummy concrete or depleted uranium warhead dropped on a high visibility target in each of the countries on the "List".

Unfortunately, the second is not going to happen without the first. And the first is not going to happen until after the next civil war -- or until after a series of major attacks on the US mainland.

8/27/2006 06:45:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Agreed.

8/27/2006 06:46:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

luc,
That's a VERY Corrosive Environment,
and you sir, just make it more so.

8/27/2006 06:47:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Bob,
What about steps suggested in
Trish's link first?
---
My list would include shutting down the Mosques of hate, and deporting or incarcerating the "holy men" that spewed there.
Border security, visa reform, on and on.
Unfortunately, I agree with Mr unspellable up there, that we aren't even ready for that YET.

8/27/2006 07:11:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

I guess trish's comment and link and mine are in the last thread.
(hers will be easier to find ;-)

8/27/2006 07:12:00 PM  
Blogger Teresita said...

Kinuachdrach said...


How would we make sure that the Bad Guys really believed that the US would follow through on any declaration?

We don't care if they believe we would follow through on any declaration. All we have to do is just follow through on our declaration.

All major political candidates, parties, organizations are explicitly & loudly committed to the declaration. Those entities that are not (e.g., Daily Kos, New York Times, BBC, UN) are laughingstocks within the US.

You do this by initiating a vast project to turn the United State into a gated covenant community protected by a laser and ABM shield. Instead of running around on the DMZ in Korea, the Army can pretend there's a DMZ along the border with Mexico and Canada. This project swallows up all discretionary funding that would otherwise build bridges to nowhere and projects like the "Robert C. Byrd Museum of Redneck History" and all military spending that would otherwise keep US forces oveseas in Germany, Korea, Okinawa, etc. Funds (and the attendant jobs) to be distributed according to the extent at which a representative or senator is on board the project. FCC and IRS harrassment and Senate hearings for media outlets who favor the European appeasement model.

8/27/2006 07:20:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

I want my bridge and my Big Byrde KKK Kostum.
Forget border security.
(I like to stay in touch w/reality
...sometimes)

8/27/2006 07:25:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

Jamie, if you have a brother, I think I met him at a reunion, circa 1992. Same bus trip to a picnic as when I met the brother of Frederica von Stade.

I met a guy who said his brother was doing counseling on a Navajo reservation.

Was that anywhere near the Hopi villages? My brother and I spent 2 weeks on the Hopi reservation (which consists of three mesa communities right in the middle of a vast Navajo reservation a few hours outside of Flagstaff...)

8/27/2006 07:35:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

Not counseling.... MEDICINE

8/27/2006 07:37:00 PM  
Blogger sam said...

Jerusalem Channel 2 News

8/27/2006 07:38:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Fiddler,
Did you, or did you not take Violin lessons in Oxnard?
(obviously, an answer is optional, but so is Jamies ;-)

8/27/2006 07:38:00 PM  
Blogger sam said...

Click on medium quality.

8/27/2006 07:39:00 PM  
Blogger luc said...

Doug said...
luc,
That's a VERY Corrosive Environment,
and you sir, just make it more so.
8/27/2006 06:47:47 PM

Doug,
I guess corrosion is to be expected with my background ;)

8/27/2006 07:48:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

Doug,

Violin lessions with Betty Ruth Dayton, at her little stucko 3-room studio just a few blocks from the the central square. I also played violin in the Dennis McKenna elementary school orchestra, then the Haydock Junior High School orchestra, and then the Ventura County Symphony.

All that was between 1958 and 1962.

Were you in the Horn Section?

Or did you agress upon a drum?

8/27/2006 07:50:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

I played the whoopee cushion.
I thought you'd remember ;-)
(even if you forgot, it would seem to be rather obvious)

8/27/2006 07:57:00 PM  
Blogger sam said...

Citizen Journalist Report

8/27/2006 07:58:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Anyhoo, just wondered when you lived near G_d's country.
Went to UCSB back in the good old days.
...well, maybe they weren't so good:
That's when Joe Wilson was there, followed by Barbara Bodine!
----
----
My dad lived in and loved Ojai for a few years, so took the family there on trips.
Wheeler's Hot Springs and etc.

8/27/2006 08:00:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

luc 07:48:40 PM add severe aging and you've got my situation.

8/27/2006 08:03:00 PM  
Blogger luc said...

Doug said...
luc 07:48:40 PM add severe aging and you've got my situation.
8/27/2006 08:03:45 PM

Doug, in that case we both must suffer from the same condition which is not a bad one to have considering what the alternative is ;)

8/27/2006 08:07:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

southern Cal in the 50s & 60s

Northern Cal from 93-2003

Between, I always told people "I'm from California."


Now I'm homesick, except for all the people that believe in the Tooth Fairy.

8/27/2006 08:13:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

And, there's still humor.
Great link Sam:
I like Jeff's video better than his website.

8/27/2006 08:15:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

08:13:54 PM Yeah, like most codgers, I guess, I'm homesick for
"how it used to be"
In my mind at least.

8/27/2006 08:16:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Speaking of NorCal:
I saw an ad for a B&B in Honeydew for some outrageous price like $600 or so.
When we were there, we were the only people for as far as the eye could see.

8/27/2006 08:19:00 PM  
Blogger sam said...

What did you do in the war, UNIFIL?:

UNIFIL has just done what it then vowed it could never do. Once again, it has acted to shield one side in the conflict and to harm the other.

Why is this permitted? For that matter, how did the U.N. obtain such detailed and timely military intelligence in the first place, before broadcasting it for Israel's enemies to see?

UNIFIL's Actions

8/27/2006 08:19:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

SAM,
Murdering bastards.
Why that place still stands in NYCity is beyond me.
I was getting all hopeful from that Video showing them destroying bunkers, but no doubt the UN will f... that up too.

8/27/2006 08:23:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

For those of you that might have had lingering doubts about the utility of the United Nations:

(from The Daily Standard; the date seems to indicate intended date of overall publication for the printed version...)

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/012/622bqwjn.asp
What did you do in the war, UNIFIL?
You broadcast Israeli troop movements.
by Lori Lowenthal Marcus
09/04/2006, Volume 011, Issue 47

DURING THE RECENT month-long war between Hezbollah and Israel, U.N. "peacekeeping" forces made a startling contribution: They openly published daily real-time intelligence, of obvious usefulness to Hezbollah, on the location, equipment, and force structure of Israeli troops in Lebanon.

UNIFIL--the United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon, a nearly 2,000-man blue-helmet contingent that has been present on the Lebanon-Israel border since 1978--is officially neutral. Yet, throughout the recent war, it posted on its website for all to see precise information about the movements of Israeli Defense Forces soldiers and the nature of their weaponry and materiel, even specifying the placement of IDF safety structures within hours of their construction. New information was sometimes only 30 minutes old when it was posted, and never more than 24 hours old.


Read More

8/27/2006 08:25:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

(Howdy sam... talk about syncronicity. I followed a link from Drudge.)

8/27/2006 08:26:00 PM  
Blogger sam said...

Fiddler,

Great minds think alike! That's why we're all here. Maybe we can make a difference. Who knows? I got the link from Pundit Review. We are dialled in, it would appear.

Doug,

Yes, I share your frustration. How do we get rid of them? Maybe stop contributing as much as we do? Financially, or otherwise? It really does belong in Europe somewhere.

8/27/2006 08:33:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Did you guys see that Claudia Rosset link I had a few days ago about Kofi Meeting with Nasrallah some year back, just prior to traveling on to Tehran, just prior too - blah blah?
Kofi's neutral too.

8/27/2006 08:38:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Fiddler:
Be sure to see sam's hot air video link.
Pretty stupid, so I liked it.

8/27/2006 08:40:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

I think it's time to start a concerted effort to either (a) stop any U.S. payments to the United Nations --- ANY UN program whatsoever, because those lying bastards don't have any conscience and will use money given for children's medical supplies for UN PERVERT functionaries to build the cages to contain their child sex slaves; or (b) Evacuate and bulldoze the building on Turtle Bay (it's an eyesore, dilapidated, and unquestionably a danger to the community), then revoke the diplomatic passports of all those fuckards.

Later, if we really see any possible way of working with any former United Nations diplomate or bribe-monger, we can do that on an ad hoc basis.

They know how to get in touch with us.

Ask any Marine for directions.

8/27/2006 08:40:00 PM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

ooops.

"diplomat"

8/27/2006 08:46:00 PM  
Blogger sam said...

Iran opens heavy-water reactor:

"They may impose some restrictions on us under pressure, but will they be able to prevent the thoughts of a nation?" Mr. Ahmadinejad said yesterday. "Will they be able to prevent the progress and technology to a nation?

They have to accept the reality of a powerful, peace-loving and developed Iran. This is in the interest of all governments and all nations, whether they like it or not."

Iran's Reactor

Peace-loving. Did you guys get that one?

8/27/2006 08:49:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

...
"whether they like it or not"
---
That is just really classic.
Too bad it isn't 100% theater.

8/27/2006 09:05:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Too him it's a puppet show:
2 bit Nazi gets to play the
"Great Actors" like they were extras.
Whoever thought we'd live to see the day.

8/27/2006 09:06:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Maybe the beat-up, emaciated and scarred political prisoners they let visit families from time to time to spread the terror have been taught to greet the public with the PEACE Sign?

8/27/2006 09:09:00 PM  
Blogger sam said...

Iran regime's meddling in Iraq poses grave threat to coalition forces:

The report adds: "Establishing greater border security is a key challenge for the Coalition troops and Iraqi Security Forces.

"We were given differing assessments of the extent of the smuggling of Improvised Explosive Devices (IEDs) across the border from Iran but we remain troubled about the implications of any such smuggling for the security of our forces and Iraqi civilians. Given the apparent ease with which IED technology can be smuggled across the border with Iran, we were pleased to hear of plans to support and develop both the Iraqi Navy and the Border Forces to help contain this threat," the UK Parliament's Defense Committee noted.

Iran Meddling

8/27/2006 09:30:00 PM  
Blogger Alexis said...

teresita:

Have the President give a State of the Union address outlining a doctrine that says the first use of nuclear weapons by any rogue state, no matter how limited the attack (or whether the attack was with a dud), will automatically result in the disproportionate and total annihilation of that state's military and industrial capability.

You assume our enemies are rational. What if they are not? What if they don't care whether their subjects get killed in the process?

The vast majority of Iranians oppose their government; that means the vast majority of Iranians are expendable in any nuclear exchange. If Islamists can nuke Israeli and American cities while ensuring that Iranian civilians get massacred in response, they will effectively "kill two birds with one stone".

Let's say we are attacked with nuclear weapons. Does anyone really believe Americans would actually use those nasty weapons on real people? No amount of talk will convince Islamists we are serious, especially since the United States would be constrained from using its nuclear deterrent by the posse of political correctness, especially the European Union.

I think the Iranian government is run by sincere "pious" men who equate killing Americans with holiness. Far from blather, the "Death to America" chants are extremely sincere, and sacrificing the lives of the vast majority of Iranians is fine with them. For men who sent thousands of boys to their death to clear mine fields and incite young men to become suicide bombers, letting tens of millions of Iranians (who oppose the regime) die in nuclear retaliation for nuking American cities won't bother them.

Threatening the "disproportionate and total annihilation of that state's military and industrial capability" is effectively meaningless. It would make far more sense to compile an extensive database of all enemy clerics -- that might actually do some good.

8/28/2006 12:06:00 AM  
Blogger sam said...

A GOP Terror Bump:

The sectarian killings that flared up in Baghdad in June and July have been reduced -- by 30 percent, says ABC News -- by intensive patrolling by U.S. and, more importantly, Iraqi troops. It's not clear, of course, whether the reductions will continue.

Other threats still exist, like Iran's nuclear program.

Killings Reduced

8/28/2006 12:24:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

The most bizarre thing to me, about Lebanon, brought up again with Nasrullah's admission of idiocy is that EVERYBODY regards the triggering event being the kidnappings, totally ignoring the missile bombardment.
Just a guess, but I would think that absent the missile attacks things would have eventuated far differently.

8/28/2006 01:44:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Great Barone Link Sam.
---
When asked what would affect the future, the British Prime Minister Harold Macmillan famously said: "Events, dear boy. Events." The event this month that I think has done most to shape opinion was the arrest in London on Aug. 9 of 23 Muslims suspected of plotting to blow up American airliners over the Atlantic.
---
It seems to be a fact -- remember the Paul Wellstone funeral in 2002? -- that when most Americans see the hard left of the Democratic Party in action, they don't much like what they see.

8/28/2006 02:12:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Buddy Larsen said...
"Nazrollah's "admission" -- isn't it just more of the "disproportionate" agitprop operation? "
---
Yeah, including my "kidnapping" comment directly above:
-I can understand why Nasty doesn't mention the Missiles.
-I can understand (since I HAVE to) why MSM don't mention the Missiles.

But why don't WE (US Govt) mention the Missiles, and it seems like even the ISRAELIS don't mention the missiles.
???

8/28/2006 02:40:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Judicial Chaos
The overriding question is how Anna Diggs Taylor was able to seize a constitutional issue.
In The Wall Street Journal this week, Circuit Judge Richard A. Posner noted delegating a national security issue "to a randomly selected member of the federal judiciary's corps of almost 700 district judges."
The Detroit judgment contributed to Posner's conclusion that "we do not have a coherent political dimension to our efforts to combat terrorism."
Judge Taylor's farce made that clear.

8/28/2006 02:55:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

A new angle on drinking & driving?

8/28/2006 04:53:00 AM  
Blogger enscout said...

alexis:

You nailed it.

Islam, while cleverly claiming to be a religion of the one true G-d, is actually a death cult in its purest form.

The mad mullahs have convinced their beleivers that this world and this life is not worthy of their existence - that martyrdom is the highest calling of men and that any unbeleiver's life isn't worth sparing.

Everybody dies sometime - while true, the timing of such has always been and should always be
G-d's purview.

Satan is well pleased with these.

8/28/2006 05:09:00 AM  
Blogger goesh said...

I think its funny as hell that they were forced to become muslims - I bet they made a video tape of it and are circulating among all their fighters - if you were one of them, wouldn't you get a good laugh over it? I sure would. It's the wave of the future - they've got the oil, they'll soon have the nukes and they ain't afraid to die and take as many of us with them as they can. We've got tough words in blogs and a war policy that holds the lives of their civilians in higher regard than our own civilians - seems to me more have already been forced to convert that we realize, or rather, are afraid to admit. allah akbar, baby!

8/28/2006 06:06:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

alexis said:

Let's say we are attacked with nuclear weapons. Does anyone really believe Americans would actually use those nasty weapons on real people? No amount of talk will convince Islamists we are serious, especially since the United States would be constrained from using its nuclear deterrent by the posse of political correctness, especially the European Union.


Of all the nuclear-capable states in the world, the United States has the most deterrent punch in its threats, because the US is the only state which has used nuclear weapons in a war. If the Islamists refuse to remember history, we might be obliged to repeat it.

Threatening the "disproportionate and total annihilation of that state's military and industrial capability" is effectively meaningless.

Oh, no, you see, Islamic culture is essential a super "He Man Woman Hater's Club" which is all about toys and prestige. If we target their military and industrial capability, we take the higher ground by not targetting their people, but it effectively brings them back to a pre-industrial agrarian mode...and they're sitting on nothing but sand (and a lot of that sand would be fused into glass).

It would make far more sense to compile an extensive database of all enemy clerics -- that might actually do some good.

It doesn't have to be either-or, we can do both.

8/28/2006 06:28:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

enscout said:

The mad mullahs have convinced their beleivers that this world and this life is not worthy of their existence - that martyrdom is the highest calling of men


Then they should have no complaints when US forces help them attain their elevated calling.

alexis said:

If Islamists can nuke Israeli and American cities while ensuring that Iranian civilians get massacred in response, they will effectively "kill two birds with one stone".

That would be a tragedy of the highest order, but there would be one shining glimmer in that dark cloud. It would be the certain end of Islamists everywhere. The West would Hulk out and go into the sort of insanity that brought the Earth two World Wars. Maybe in the middle of that conflagration some "moderate" Muslims might stand up finally say, "Gee, you know, Hassan Chop doesn't really speak for us."

8/28/2006 06:36:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

sam said:

Why is this permitted? For that matter, how did the U.N. obtain such detailed and timely military intelligence in the first place, before broadcasting it for Israel's enemies to see?

Maybe when Israel took out that one UN position (and created such a kerfuffle in the media), they were dialing back the more egregious spying that was going on, or at least sending a message for the UN to do so.

8/28/2006 06:41:00 AM  
Blogger Tony said...

Teresita said: Walk away. We've had historic enemies who acquired WMDs before (USSR, China) and as soon as they got their nuclear mojo they found out it's only good for retaliation and you can't go swinging the thing around.

This sounds like the approach we took to Al Qaeda - don't make us mad or you'll be sorry! Didn't work out so good.

Likewise with Russia, they didn't use nukes, and neither did we, instead we fought several dozen wars around the world, with Korea and Nam only the most famous ones in America. We had to fight those land wars because we couldn't confront the enemy directly.

Doesn't look like a good plan to me. Especially with Iran, now that the land wars are going to take place in the heart of the global oil economy.

Nah, not a good plan.

8/28/2006 07:48:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

Well, in the US News & World Report the is a very interesting piece, authored by Linda Robinson.
The "Battle for Baghdad" describes the current Plan. It also gives a reasonable report as to how we arrived at this point.

Funny thing, and doug will appreciate this, we discussed each of the current troubles, contemperaneously as they developed, with the solutions now proposed, outlined then.

A bottom up, rather than top down, approach, basicly.

D+5 years. The Lessons Learned finally sinking in. But even then success is not ensured.
Not when on Post speed traps are the priority in Iraq for MPs.

Ralph Peters has a very good article in the Weekly Standard.
Return of the Tribes.
"The resistance to globalization runs deep"

8/28/2006 08:16:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

tony said:

Likewise with Russia, they didn't use nukes, and neither did we, instead we fought several dozen wars around the world, with Korea and Nam only the most famous ones in America. We had to fight those land wars because we couldn't confront the enemy directly.

We didn't have to fight those land wars at all, actually. What was in our national interest to fight in Korea? To keep it democratic and capitalist? What did that do for us when the Korean people now consider the Americans the biggest threat in the region and their president is proudly anti-American? What was in our national interest to fight in Vietnam? Thirty years later the country is united and looks like a bastion of mercantilism that would make Adam Smith beam with joy. Sixty years of hostility facing the Warsaw Pact in Europe and now the Europeans consider us the greatest threat to world peace. All that sacrifice, and it meant about as much in the end as winning the race to the moon.

8/28/2006 08:36:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

tony said:

This sounds like the approach we took to Al Qaeda - don't make us mad or you'll be sorry! Didn't work out so good.

Certainly al-Qaeda is sorry to have 90% of their operations ripped to shreds, and we are sorry for thinking that if we just follow what the four guys with box cutters will say, everyone will be alright. But we can't afford (and the world won't sit still for) a program of active pre-emption of everything we consider a threat to our national security. Pull the boys home and laager up.

8/28/2006 08:42:00 AM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

This is terrible. Just terrible. We have hurt the feelings of the Islamic Fascists so badly by calling them Islamic Fascists and by trying to blow their people to kingdom come after they have been slaughtering Christians, Jews, Bhuddists, Zoroastrians, Copts, Animists, Pagans, and even their own insufficiently pious Mohammedans for FOURTEEN CENTURIES, that they were driven to kidnap yet another pair of Western Journalists and persuade them to convert to Islam.

Wow. I repent of all my mean and sinful badness. I for one am utterly convinced that Mr. Cintanni and Mr. Wigg suddenly were given a pure insight into the gentle loving embrace of Allah, and saw how foolish they had been. It would never occur to me that being in the custody of the brothers of those who have routinely sawn the heads from other infidels, who have routinely strapped high explosives and schrapnel belts to their own children and sent them forth to kill other people's children on the public ways, who have planted high explosive bombs and blown to bits ISLAMIC kids playing soccer, who have blown up public busses, cafes, pizza parlors, and airplanes... sorry... where was I? Oh, yeah— I completely believe their conversion was utterly un-coerced and genuine.

Shame on Mr. Bush for doing all those mean things to the kind and gentle Islamic terrorists. I hope he will go home now and just have a good long think, so we can all sit down and have tea.


A very mean-spirited acquaintance (whose views I here reject and disavow, but they're entertaining, so I'm passing them along...) said:

My first thought is, "God damned stupid primitive turds."

Next, "You have to laugh or cry that people can be so pathetically stupid as to believe such crude behavior can accomplish anything but the opposite of what they want."

Finally I wake up and realize that in fact, this is just a variation of what the Liberals have been doing to their welfare clients for most of the last century. Hold'em hostage by confiscatory taxes until they 'fess up that the Democratic Party is their savior, and then they can have all the goodies they want.


That was my un-named acquaintance, not me. You have to make some allowances for him. He's from another planet. *I* am as innocent and mild as the wind-blown snow.

8/28/2006 10:21:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Haven't read all comments yet, but if somebody is pimping Ms Daisyfresh, they're in big trouble w/me.
King Pimp.

8/28/2006 10:26:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Rush had ten minute on MSM treatment of Katrina that leaves you nauseous/bemused:
Girlymen breathlessly talking about it like it was world's greatest disaster, mainly cause Bush botched it so bad, QUESTION TO CLINTON ABOUT WHAT HE WOULD HAVE DONE!
Another question about media trashing of his fragile flower wife...
If it comes down to Hillary vs McCain, it's the cup for me.
Goodbye cruel world and all that.

8/28/2006 10:32:00 AM  
Blogger Doug said...

Somebody's been poaching Possum's Cousins TOO?

8/28/2006 10:35:00 AM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

I agree with Catherine above.

Stalin during the 30's had killed off tens of millions of Ukrainians very publicly, to crush opposition to his plan to collectivize (or "sovietize") the agricultural system, and to demonstrate to the rest of the USSR what they could expect if THEY got out of line.

After farmers in the Ukraine dumped their milk and wheat on the dirt, and slaughter their pigs rather than sell to the Soviet government at prices they felt were grotesquely unfair, Stalin instructed his miltary and secret police apparatus to arrest and murder tens of thousands of Kulaks (the "middle-class" or reasonably comfortable farm owner class.) Men, women, children, grandmas, shot behind the police station or in their barns or fields or in their bungalows. Then the troops gathered up all the cows, hogs, chickens, ducks, geese, wheat, millet, onions, and turnips and loaded them onto trains, while the people they hadn't executed yet stood there watching.

The trains chugged out of the station, The troops relocated to the borders to keep the people from leaving. The people starved.

I mention this to provide a little context for folks who wonder why there were virulent ANTI-communists in the U.S. government. Stalin may have guarded a lot of secrets, but he was not shy about letting the world know he was always ready to murder his own citizens in ton lots.

Not surprisingly, the Western Left continues to be silent about this aspect of communism.

So that was the sort of brutal truth that guided a lot of U.S. policy — that communism was a vast, brutal, conspiracy of animalistic murder.

You have to make policies based on the facts you have.

The "gentled" aspect of many of our former adversaries is not proof that we had no need to oppose them in decades past. It's an indication that their system never worked, and they're coming around.

8/28/2006 10:44:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Nice post, Catherine. Not that everyone else's posts are not also nice, too, and stuff, but your'n ayr expecially nice.

8/28/2006 11:20:00 AM  
Blogger Mad Fiddler said...

I apologize for my sloppy toss of death figures.

Stalin's victims really deserve a little more detailed listing.

I don't think I can do that here and leave much room for anything else on the thread.

Try doing an internet search on keywords "Stalin Kulaks Ukraine Collectivization" and suchlike.

8/28/2006 11:31:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

Fiddler, as you know, Walter Duranty of the New York Times won a Pulitzer for keeping the story of Stalin's murderousness from the American people.

8/28/2006 11:38:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

He had "seen the future, and it works!", and nothing, that is, *nothing* was going to interfere with his storyline.

America to the NYTimes, during the 30s, was as Country Boy walking around with a pocketful of cyanide pills sold to him as nice candy LifeSavers.

8/28/2006 11:43:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

catherine said:

In fact, one could credibly muse that, had we prosecuted even more vigorously against the USSR and proxies back when they were expansionist and seeking to undermine the West, we might not be suffering the noxious Soviet-Russian stirring of the Islamist jihadi pot today

Stirring the pot? Do you mean the Russian army engaging in armed conflict in jihadi Chechnya (parallel to our armed conflict in jihadi Afghanistan and jihadi Iraq) or do you mean Russia's new atomic energy contracts with Iran (parallel to our new atomic energy contracts with India)?

8/28/2006 11:51:00 AM  
Blogger buddy larsen said...

I'm from Mars, and have no stake in any of these earth affairs, so, I agree with Teresita.

8/28/2006 11:54:00 AM  
Blogger Teresita said...

the mad fiddler wrote:

So that was the sort of brutal truth that guided a lot of U.S. policy — that communism was a vast, brutal, conspiracy of animalistic murder.

The US doesn't respond to conspiracies of animalistic murder (President Clinton described US inaction as 1,000,000 Tutsis and moderate Hutus were slaughtered in Rwanda as "the biggest regret of my administration") unless the ideology behind the brutal conspiracy directly challenges the American Way.

8/28/2006 12:06:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

12:15:04 PM By far the most astounding post of the day.
The March of the Brave New Worlders goes on.

8/28/2006 12:40:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

If we started referring to someone as
"Terrestrial Rita"
Might that bring things back to Earth?

8/28/2006 12:43:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

"Might your tough talk be a feint and you're really an isolationist Boocannonite or a Make-bread-not-bombs-and-rockets acolyte?"
---
Good Call:
She kinda sorta came out one day so to speak, with all kinds of cute equivalencies between us and them in various venues, and condeming unequivically Hiroshima.
Saving lives only counts for the Rational Earth-Dwellers.

8/28/2006 12:45:00 PM  

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