Tuesday, March 14, 2006

Do unto others before they do unto you

Ahmed Saadat was seized by Israeli soldiers from a Palestinian Authority jail in Jericho after it was feared that he would be released by the new Hamas administration and very shortly after the British monitors guarding him had left the compound. The Telegraph reports:

Britain's tiny contingent of monitors left Jericho's jail soon after 9am yesterday, telling Palestinian staff that they were taking their car to be fixed. In reality they had no intention of returning to watch over its 200 inmates, among them Ahmed Saadat, the man accused of masterminding the assassination of Rehavam Zeevi, Israel's tourism minister, in 2001. ...

Saadat's cell was more of an office. He had telephones and television sets. The jail's Palestinian guards stayed away from his quarters, which included a kitchen and an area to receive guests. ...

The military operation to raid the jail truly began at the moment the British passed an Israeli army checkpoint, according to senior Israeli commanders. "One, two, three, I counted the British monitors out," said an Israeli colonel, second-in-command of yesterday's operation. "We have standing orders to act in this case, so we went in." Within minutes, a passage of time that provoked furious Palestinian accusations of collusion between Britain and the Israelis, the mission was under way. Gen Guy Tzur insisted that there had been no co-operation with Britain. The operation had been prompted by Palestinian hints that Saadat and five others wanted for Mr Reevi's killing might be released.

These men were held in jail pursuant to the Ramallah Agreement. Although I can't find the text of the agreement itself, here is some background on the provisions of the Ramallah Agreement brokered in 2002, which allowed Yasser Arafat to leave his office, then under siege by the Israeli Defense Forces. Here's a contemporaneous account by the San Francisco Chronicle as reproduced at Common Dreams.

Despite the diplomatic cover offered by Bush and Rice, however, many Israelis interpret the affair as a backing down by Sharon.

"There was very, very heavy pressure on Sharon, personal pressure applied by Bush," said diplomatic commentator Akiva Eldar. "The pressure is also connected to Bush's meeting last Friday with Saudi Crown Prince Abdullah. Lifting the siege on Arafat was one of the things that Bush promised to the Saudis."

Indeed, Sharon had told Secretary of State Colin Powell only two weeks ago that he would "rather go to elections" than let the six people in Arafat's compound go free. The six are the four killers of Israeli Tourism Minister Rehavam Ze'evi, a personal friend of Sharon's, as well as Ahmed Saadat, the leader of the militant Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine -- whom Israel accuses of organizing and executing dozens of terrorist attacks -- and Palestinian Authority finance chief Fuad Shubaki, believed by Israel to have orchestrated the Karine A weapons-smuggling affair. Arafat carried out a trial last week in which the six were all found guilty and given sentences ranging from one to 18 years.

Israel quickly denounced the proceeding as a farce, noting that Palestinians are often convicted and imprisoned only to be released a few days or weeks later. Successive U.S. administrations have spoken disparagingly of Arafat's "revolving door" policy toward justice for militants. ...

"If these four people killed the minister, then yes, they should go to prison," said Sameer Abdullah, a bank executive in Ramallah. "But Ahmed Saadat (the PFLP leader) is very popular here in Ramallah, and people are very angry that he will have to go to prison. People are saying that he is someone who is a fighter and who simply has fought for his political ideals, and they do not want him to go."

A team of British experts arrived yesterday to ascertain how many and what kind of monitors should be put in place. But by late in the day, no decisions had been reached, and Arafat remained in his compound. "We don't know if these people monitoring the prisoners will be American policemen or soldiers," said Paul Patton, the press attache at the U.S. Embassy in Tel Aviv. "The British have a lot of experience with this type of thing in Northern Ireland, and so they'll be able to bring that experience to this situation," he added. "We think we have achieved a lot by ending this standoff, and we hope we'll be able to get Bethlehem cleared next."

Of interest too are the Hansard transcripts of February 8, 2006 in the British House of Commons during which a backbencher asked about the role of the British monitors in Saadat's detention.

Mr. Clappison: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what the basis is for UK/US monitoring of the detention of Ahmed Saardat of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine; what assessment he has made of the reported declaration by Hamas that it would release Mr. Saardat; whether he plans to make changes in UK arrangements for the monitoring of this detention; and if he will make a statement.

Dr. Howells: Ahmed Saadat is one of the six Palestinian detainees held by the Palestinian Authority in Jericho as part of the 2002 Ramallah Agreement with Israel. The US/UK role is simply to monitor the terms of this agreement and to report any non-compliance. The Ramallah Agreement states that any changes in the status of the detainees should be agreed between Israel and the Palestinian Authority.


Here's a link to the letter of the British and American consuls informing both the Palestinian Authority and Israel that they were done guarding Saadat. The key passages are reproduced below. I think my analysis in commentary still stands.

The Palestinian Authority has never fully complied with basic provision of the agreement that established the US and UK Jericho Monitoring Mission. While the six detainees - Fuad Shobaki, Ahmad Sa'adat, Iyad Gholmi, Hamdi Qur'an, Majdi Rmawi, and Basel al-Asmar - are held in continuous custody at the Jericho Prison, the Palestinian Authority has consistently failed to comply with core prevision of the Jericho monitoring arrangement regarding visitors, cell searches, telephone access and correspondence. Furthermore, the Palestinian Authority has failed to provide secure conditions for the US and US personnel working gat the Jericho Prison. Repeated demarches by our governments to the highest levels of the Palestinian Authority have not resulted in improved compliance with the Jericho monitoring arrangements. The pending handover of governmental power to a political party that has repeatedly called for the release of the Jericho detainees also calls into question the political sustainability of the monitoring mission.


The agreement appears to have provided for the Palestinian custody of six men wanted by the Israelis as a precondition to the settlement of hostilities then under way. The British monitors were emplaced in order to prevent the immediate release of the six probably because the Israelis did not trust the Palestinian Authority to keep its end of the deal.

One wonders whether Dr. Howell had a presentiment that the deal was coming apart when he noted that "The Ramallah Agreement states that any changes in the status of the detainees should be agreed between Israel and the Palestinian Authority." Although I can't find the text of the agreement, a plain reading of Dr. Howells' statement suggests that the Palestinian Authority could have not have legally released Ahmed Saadat from detention, if the conditions of his custody could be called that, without violating the Ramallah Agreement. Maybe both parties were planning to renege, and the Israelis reneged first.


Blogger Freedom Fighter said...

Wretched, if you readhere , you will see that Abbas had already stated(as had Hamas) that he was going to disavow the agreement and free Ahmed Sadat and his fellow assasins.

You will also find the text of a letter sent to Abbas stating clearly that the monitors were going to be removed due to the Palestinians failure to provide evenbasic security for them unless things changed.

Sadat, the head of the radical PFLP won a seat in the Palestinian parliament in the recent elections, and this essentially was an `up yours' to the Americans, the British and the Israelis...especially since Iran, the UAE and Saudi Arabia have now confirmed that they will finance the new terrorist Hamas state.

As per usual, the Palestinians thought they could get away with violating their agreements with impunity.

This time, Israel simply took matters into its own hands.

Good for them.

3/14/2006 06:36:00 PM  
Blogger sam said...

The walls of Jericho:

The decision to pull out the monitors then triggered the Israeli action, and the Palestinian protests which followed. The unhappy consequence is that the prospect of achieving enough in the way of pragmatic agreements on different topics between the Israelis and the Palestinians to allow, at least for a while, co-existence without much violence has been damaged.

So has the the standing of some western countries, particularly Britain, seen by many Palestinians as having colluded with Israel in the attack on the jail. Since they are prominent among the available mediators between Hamas and the Israelis, that is doubly unfortunate.

The Walls of Jericho

3/14/2006 06:46:00 PM  
Blogger wretchard said...


The Brits had to maintain their credibility with both sides. To stay would have provided physical cover for Saadat's release. Given that the deal was off, they were going to be left holding the bag. So they gave notice and split.

My own take is that no one should ever be guarantor to deal done in bad faith. That was the basic mistake. Mabe there's a moral in there somewhere.

3/14/2006 07:10:00 PM  
Blogger 2164th said...

I find it perplexing that the British pulled the monitors out at this time. What was the urgency? You have to hand it to the Israelis. Wouldn't it have been refreshing to have US agents capture Mohammad Ali Hamadi, the killer of US serviceman, Robert Stethem, after his release by the Germans?

3/14/2006 07:23:00 PM  
Blogger diabeticfriendly said...

Terrorists that are allowed to live and murder another day, usually do, under the flag of Palestine.

Maybe a nice piece of hot metal coated in pig fat should have been inserted into said terrorist's posterior?

3/14/2006 07:26:00 PM  
Blogger PD Quig said...


But that's not on the roadmap, is it? Can't be straying from the roadmap.

3/14/2006 08:57:00 PM  
Blogger For Freedom said...

Three cheers for Israel!

Expect plenty more perfidy from the Palestinians. If there is another attack on America, expect them to dance in the streets.

Time for the West to understand that we are all Israelis now. We are all Danish now.

3/14/2006 09:10:00 PM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

The WOT cannot end until the Right of Return is properly addressed and conclusive and final action is taken. The stones comprising the Dome of the Rock must be returned to their natural quarry habitat, and St. Sophia in Constantinople must be returned to its builders and rightful owners.

The Palestinian Arabs make claim to inalienable irredentist rights. They are correct in their claim but mistaken in its application. The push back year that makes it right is 599 AD.

3/15/2006 01:53:00 AM  
Blogger dennisw said...

The best part is this daring snatch and grab was done during the fun and frivolity of the Purim holiday.

3/15/2006 02:05:00 AM  
Blogger blert said...

You mean 10 hour snatch and grab.

3/15/2006 03:20:00 AM  
Blogger enscout said...

I figured one of the purposes of constructing the wall was so that Israel would not need to foray into Palistinian territory and micro-manage security in those areas.

With daily rocket attacks eminating from Gaza and now this it would seem Israel needs to adjust her tactics to better fit the new realities.

Allowing Iran and her leaders to run interferance for the bad boys across the fence is a zero sum game.

3/15/2006 04:48:00 AM  
Blogger Papa Ray said...

[Acting Prime Minister] Ehud Olmert has no good choices in this election period that is fast coming to a head.

He claims that he is following Sharon's gameplan, his advisors are telling him he has to try and react like they [think] Sharon would.

This situation at the prison has been going on for a long time. Prisoners allowed out of cells, co-mingling, use of cell phones, generally a prison that was not a prison but a paid for by the west, rest area for terrorists.

The American and English monitors had been forced to roof top hides for their own protection and had been threating to leave for some time.

But, forgetting all that, the election cycle is dicating Israel's reactions and plans. After the election, we will see who can be the most bloodthirsty, who will decide if walls are enough or if air strikes and Special Ops will need to be carried out with more violence and intensity.

While the plan now is to give up more territory to the Hamas terrorists, that could change, no matter who wins in the election.

For Israel, these are not "interesting times" that they are living in, these times will decide if they are not only to survive but how much they are willing to thumb their nose at the rest of the world to protect their small nation and their future.

My money is on them doing what has to be done and to hell with the rest of the world.

I wish Bush could catch some of their passion and their determination.

Papa Ray
West Texas

3/15/2006 07:24:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

Meanwhile, in Paris, a car bomb explodes.
No ties to terrorism, though.
Nothing to see, move on, please

3/15/2006 07:31:00 AM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

The action by Israeli forces may come off as draconian but I believe that the message has to be to Middle Easterners is that; “if you say it, we believe it”. Threaten to free a political assassin and we will do something that your fellow country wont, we will believe you. When I hear Iranians bleating “Death to America”, I believe.

The Palestinians play the Liberal game, vigorously establish guilt, then go easy on the perpetrator. The only interruption on Saadat’s life was he didn’t have to do his own grocery shopping. This description on Saadat’s incarceration evokes a scene straight out of “Good Fellows”.

“People are saying that he is someone who is a fighter and who simply has fought for his political ideals, and they do not want him to go”. One can’t fault a race of ‘rock throwers’ their heros, but the honorable way for a militant to die at the hands of his executioners is by firing squad. They should accord him the honor.

Either way this situation put British and US soldiers in an unnecessary and degrading predicament. No wonder that this humiliating decision put the Palestinians on edge. The Israelis should have pummeled the ‘compound’ to shards while everyone was expecting it. The Palestinians would have gotten over it, and if not, where would we be now, staring in the eyes of a Hamas controlled government?

Finally, the gloves come off. Maybe Belgium can step up to the bat.

3/15/2006 07:31:00 AM  
Blogger Goesh said...

-the main thing was the palis kidnapped some Humanitarian workers, no doubt the real culprits behind this whole affair..

3/15/2006 07:32:00 AM  
Blogger skipsailing said...

I agree with annoy mouse, the inflamatory rhetoric of these islamic thugs must be taken seriously.

Our civilization is under threat and we better understand that and confront it now. A bad situation is not likely to get better all by itself.

And this is a bad situation.

3/15/2006 08:25:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

Why pussyfoot around? We know who the enemy is. Every known member of Hamas, Islamic Jihad, and the dozen or so other Palestinian nutjob groups should be captured or killed on sight.

3/15/2006 08:45:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

And not to be discriminatory every Hezbu'allah in Lebanon should be permanently fixed at the end of a gunsight.

3/15/2006 08:52:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

That is not on the course we are staying, pb.
Islam is a Religion of Peace.
We have made the decision that the Palistinians deserve their own State. When the decision was made to desert the Gaza, many waited withe bated breath for the hammer to fall on the Palistinians.

Now after multiple rocket attacks against Israel, they still wait.

The US and it's allies, we are staying the course, pb, enjoy the ride.

3/15/2006 08:54:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

They can have a state. It just wouldn't include any living members of Hamas et al.

3/15/2006 09:12:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

The election has brought Hamas legitimacy, I'm afraid.

Israel and US can cut their allowance, but if a Oil Prince or Iran or some combination make up the difference, there will be Hamas in charge of Palistine.

The US has actively engaged Palistinians "moderates" not to join the Hamas Government, as well as Fatah. We assume Hamas failure at Ruling.

Hamas, well they'll have all Palistine, for what it's worth. They still want all of Israel.
That is their course.
Ours is one of moderation and accomadation.

Before, referencing the Mohammedan Wars, you swore that the President and the Generals knew the best course.
Why not now?

3/15/2006 09:23:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

I haven't changed my opinion of the direction I'd like to see things go. I just don't complain about it when they don't.

3/15/2006 10:06:00 AM  
Blogger skipsailing said...

I don't agree Desert Rat. The palestine elections didn't make Hamas "legitimate". Witness the uproar about funding.

What the election did do was show us in the west exactly who the palestinians are. the selected Hamas and we should understand that clearly.

3/15/2006 10:18:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

Fatah is/was no different from Hamas. Just better cross dressers. Everybody already knew that.

3/15/2006 10:24:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

Then you approved of funding Fatah to the tune of $80 Million USD per month? The aprox. total of Israeli and US payments to the PA, pb.

If you thought those payments detremental to US efforts in the War, and you failed to speak up about it, to "complain", you contributed to their continuence.
You've aided the Enemy with your silence.

Perhaps, if those payments had been "well known" and people "complained" they'd have been stopped, sooner.

The legitimecy of Hamas as representitives of Palistine is not ours to grant or deny.
It is given by the "Will of the People". Hamas has both legitimecy, as well as the ground, now.
Where were you in Civics class?

We can withhold funding, in an attempt to further disrupt the social fabric of Palistine, but we have seen to it, Hamas and Palistine are now one and the same.

3/15/2006 10:43:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

When the US pressured Israel into letting Hamas on the ballot, they were "legitimized".
By US.

3/15/2006 10:45:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

Just none of the Striped Pants could envision they'd win.
or did they?

Stay the Course, pb, stiff upper lip.

No complaints, no regrets.

3/15/2006 10:49:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

What do you mean "we have seen to it"? Are you a CIA Magic Wander?

3/15/2006 10:52:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

The Israeli were not going to allow Hamas on the ballot.

We saw to it, that they were.

It was all US
that allowed Hamas to be on the ballot,
and WIN!!!

That they did on their own.

But who allowed Fatah to waste their money?
Whose money was it, really?
The money men knew the cash was goin' down a rat hole.

US & Israel, Fatah's main moneymen.
Almost 1 Billion USD, annually.

3/15/2006 11:02:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

State Sponsors of Terror?

money is, after all, fungible.

As you say
"... Fatah is/was no different from Hamas. ... ... Everybody already knew that. ..."

3/15/2006 11:15:00 AM  
Blogger skipsailing said...

Well I made a tactic mistake. I should have asked Desert rat to define "legitimate".

Indeed, we must live with Hamas as the new face of the palestinians.

that's OK, at least they cannot talk out of both sides of their mouths like yasser did. They cannot "deplore" violence while at the same relying on it.

and many of us objected to the funding of many regimes world wide. I'd like to see us confront mubarak for example.

The election of Hamas also tarnished the victim image of the palestinians. It will be much harder for them to continue their poor mouthing now.

Bravo to Israel. It's a fight to the death and the Israelis know it.

3/15/2006 11:27:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

Israel had no more ability to keep Hamas candidates off the ballot than the US had to prevent their election. It's unfortunate that any Western country ever gave the PLO/PA a single nickel. The funding was supposed to be through NGOs directly to grass roots institutions although the EUSSR never really cared who it went to. Hopefully some will catch on that they're financing the murder of their own citizens.

Israel doesn't "give" the PA money. Israel administers the collection of taxes for them.

3/15/2006 11:29:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

Once the "tax" is collected, how it is dispersed is up to the collector.

This is blantedly obvious. They Israelis have stopped the payments.
They could have at any time, but chose to underwrite Fatah.

The only folks that can "Force" the Israelis to do anything is US.

In Jerusalem the Israelis were not going to allow Hamas on the ballot, the Election would have been cancelled/ postponed.
That did not suit percieved US interests. They Israelis compromised, Hamas won.

There are advantages to having Hamas alone in governing Palastine, but there are dangers as well.

But next time, you see a reef or a Billion USD sandbar ahead, pb, sound off!

I've got a cot for ya'

3/15/2006 11:40:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

You are a Magic Wander. Thought so.

3/15/2006 11:44:00 AM  
Blogger wretchard said...

Stratfor argues that the prison raid, in the short run, is good for Kadima but that Hamas, in order to keep its cred, must strike back at Israel. Unless things change course over the coming months, Hamas is on track to create a state dedicated to the destruction of Israel with or without EU and US funding, as Iran and the rest may pick up the slack. Unchecked, that will spark off a future war in the Middle East, which will no longer necessarily take the form of a clash of armies but an exchange of missiles on each other's cities. Palestine itself may be no big deal, but it is big enough to serve as a fuse.

I was just reading Michael Orren's Six Days of War, where Nasser's mouth dragged his feet into the conflict and his subsequent Big Lie to cover his humiliation dragged the Middle East into an even more prolonged war. Idiots may not win wars, but they can start them. And Hamas' mouth (and the Iranian President's) is as big as Nasser's.

3/15/2006 12:44:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

“Hamas and Palestine are one in the same.” All the better. The Clinton administration bought off the PA for their half-assed attempt to follow the ‘Road-map’, calculating that this would solve the Palestinian problem. Nearly a decade later the festering wound still defies efficacious solution. If the Palestinians stop complying with the ‘Road-Map’ we can sweeten the deal with inducements, such as targeted assassinations and carefully administered high-explosives. We are a democracy and we can influence other democracies by any means that suits us, subtle or not. If the present administration has gotten it wrong then we can register our disaffections in the next election. I wouldn’t look to either party to use deadly force in this demarche to madness, besides, the balls in Israel’s court. Let them punt, pass, or call the game and initiate crowd control.

The most disturbing events, the best that I can tell, is the KSA taking up the slack where the EU and the US have pulled back. Although I believe the West has every reason to give up with peaceful negotiations with the denizens of this veritable hell-hole, I am pissed the Saudis would put themselves in the fray at direct odds to their ‘allies’ in the West. Oh well, it should make for interesting TV.

P.S. are you baiting PB?

3/15/2006 01:05:00 PM  
Blogger blert said...

All of these financial aid was kicked in as a sop to Saudi Arabia.

Logrolling is behind everything.

Bush & Co are playing for time, pacing WWIV.

Al Qaeda in Iraq is going off the rails. Next target Sadr & Co. Then...?

WWIV as a serial roll-up? It could happen.

3/15/2006 01:06:00 PM  
Blogger desert rat said...

am, me?

it is the KSA behind the wahabbists in the first place.

No way they'll let Hamas fail for lack of cash, nor the Iranians. There could even be "bidding", an influence auction.
Remember, Hamas won cause they are trust worthy with money. They are not corrupt. Killers but honest.

It is an interesting dance to watch, but from way afar. I think our host is correct, when the fuze gets lit, there is gonna be a bang.

I am afraid that the Iranians will deliver their promise of "harm and pain" no matter the percieved recriprical costs.

3/15/2006 01:16:00 PM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

"Any retreat will, under the present circumstances, bring with it an unending chain of pressures and more retreats. It is therefore clear that [Iran's nuclear] path is irreversible and our foreign policy establishment must courageously defend this right".

• Iran's Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, official state news agency, 14 March 2006 Iran Focus

Iran certainly seems to be on a path that makes confrontation inevitable. Whether public opposition or secular business interests can change that path is not known.

Any conflict with Iran would suck in Syria, Lebanon, Palestine and Israel either as states or substantial paramilitaries. Who knows what mischief Iran has planned outside the ME.

3/15/2006 01:18:00 PM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

3/15/2006 01:20:00 PM  
Blogger desert rat said...

As well, pb, as our hosts in Iraq.
Who knows where all those different factions in Iraq would shake out.

3/15/2006 01:22:00 PM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...


rat is chumming but he can't rig his gear.

3/15/2006 01:23:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

I am physically a big buy and from time to time, in my youth, I have been confronted by some swarthy little sh!t who gets in face trying to pick it with me. I have learned that this could be for 1 of 2 reasons only. 1. Yosemite Sam friends are waiting around the corner waiting for 1st contact. (Even assassins need to have a self-defense claim), or 2. The Frito Bandito is packing a pee shooter and plans on spending the holidays south of the border. Either way situational awareness will keep me in control.

Since the PA doesn’t have direct access to weapons of any significant quantity or quality (I understand that even rocks are becoming scarce… stuck on the other side of the fence), I am ruling out reason 2 and leaning towards reason 1, the Pali’s are expecting their co-religionist friends to throw in with them. This may be more coordinated than OPEC ever was or lead to a major Charlie Foxtrot, the later which I believe.

A year ago much of the bleeding heart Left ‘felt’ sorry for the Palestinians. They will not begin supporting Israel but maybe, they will saunter off and start a new rallying cry, like; Save the whales, dolphins, the rain forest, or maybe, just maybe, the backbone of Western governments. We used to be at an impasse with the PLO in deference to the Palestinian people, now we have no pretense to be concerned that the Palestinian people are but innocent pawns in the PLO game. They are democratically in charge, hooray for them.

So a confrontation is in the books by my estimate so we need to act accordingly. Stop funding terror states now.

3/15/2006 01:33:00 PM  
Blogger whit said...

The so-called Palestinians aren't to be trusted so matter which faction is in control. But then, I don't trust any Arab or Muslim country these days. Even Turkey is slipping into fundamentalism.

We are headed into a confluence. We should have entered it years ago but got sidetracked when we stupidly let Arafat off the hook in Lebanon and again when we let him return from Tunisia. It's been a fools game ever since and I say it's time quit playing games. If the fundies want to push it, let's get it over with and let someone else sort through the rubble.

3/15/2006 02:36:00 PM  
Blogger enscout said...

"So a confrontation is in the books by my estimate so we need to act accordingly. Stop funding terror states now."

The confrontation has been going on for years. Currently Iran is shipping ordinance into Iran to kill US.

As lomg as we maintain our dependance on ME oil, we will continue to fund terror states.

The war must begin here. WE have enough untapped reserves to become independant of their cheap oil. We only lack the resolve.

It's up to US.

3/15/2006 02:56:00 PM  
Blogger whit said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

3/15/2006 03:05:00 PM  
Blogger whit said...

You would think that's apparent to everyone by now but I'm afraid that it will take a lot more than 9/11 to wake up America.

3/15/2006 03:07:00 PM  
Blogger enscout said...


In my mind I can forsee the worst case scenario:
-Dems control the House or Senate in '06.
-Dems take the White House in '08 & proclaim all is well in the world.
-Katie, bar the door.

I know there are many splodeydopes that can't wait for their encounter with 72 virgins, but the mad mullahs know that if they wait until the lefties control things here, we become a pushover for them.

3/15/2006 03:13:00 PM  
Blogger whit said...

Maybe I am just being hopeful, but I can't see the Dems making any significant gains. People may not be happy with Republicans but I would like to see some true and honest polling numbers on the Democrats.

3/15/2006 03:23:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

Too many years of wishful thinking. As the inevitable tumult approaches, I sigh with relief, peace would have been real cool, but putting off war for an unattainable peace is a fools game indeed.

You can’t play one religious zealot against another. Iran, Pakistan, Syria, Palestine, KSA, (UAE?), Iraq for that matter. You can’t run afoul of the one and hope for the forbearance of the other. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Pity though.

The one good thing about the Dems is that they, being weak, like to play strong on defense by fighting wars. Let them. FDR- WWII JFK-VN WJC-Kosovo

Let’s roll.

3/15/2006 03:35:00 PM  
Blogger desert rat said...

The Dems could pick up as many as 10 to 12 House seats, in November.

It's broken down almost by district by Jay Cost Realclearpolitics

" ... 95% of House incumbents are running again, and the reelection rate of incumbents in the last three cycles has averaged 99%. ... "

So only 21 or 22 House seats will even be contested, the results will be split, about 50/50.
The other 1%, 4 seats, those'll split, too.

3/15/2006 03:41:00 PM  
Blogger enscout said...

The Dems are so heavily invested in our (US) defeat that they will have a hard time squaring any campaign rhetoric that's positive. Only bickering about the way things stand in Iraq.

Kerry's '08 campaign slogan: Vote for Change!

Once again he's not giving up his secret (that he has no plan - for anything - except higher taxes). The DNC has no plan either. Only criticism of Bush, Cheney, DeLay, etc.

The ME is a mess we will not fix easily, if ever.

Meanwhile, the real war -the one that counts for the world's best hope for the future - is being fought here.

3/15/2006 03:46:00 PM  
Blogger desert rat said...

He also discusses the breakdown of the districts, further, here.

" ... As it stands, the Republicans have 17 open seats to defend. The Democrats have 9. Historically speaking, with an economy as strong as todays, and the party of the President having to defend 8 more open seats than the opposition, we can expect the Republicans to lose about 9 net seats. My sense is that the final figure will be slightly lower than that. The reason for this is that this estimate takes into account the quantity, but not the quality, of open seats in play. In 2006, the quality of Republican open seats is very poor from the Democrats perspective. Consider the following: ... "

3/15/2006 03:48:00 PM  
Blogger enscout said...

Tim Russert on NBC Nightly News:
"the Democrats opened up a 13% bulge" (in the latest NBC News Poll asking "who should control Congress?"). "That's good news".

NBC = Dem's propaganda machine.

3/15/2006 03:51:00 PM  
Blogger whit said...

A problem with the media these days is that they all want to be "talking heads". Too much politics as sport and not enough old fashioned, "just the facts" reporting.

I used to think a lot of more of Russert. Nowadays, I don't even bother with him.

3/15/2006 03:58:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

The Dems argument is they would do everything Bush did but better, more nuanced, and everybody will like us because deep down inside we are good people. I’m not saying that the Dems will be particularly aggressive, because they won’t, but our enemies might even play nice for a while just to show that their only problem was GWB. That’s the beauty of democracy, you get to start over, unlike the generational pissing contest between the US and Cuba.

If the Dems win all, look at the bright side. They get to swallow the poison pill they have been promoting, a draft, and tax hikes to strangle the economy and fuel the war. Nationalized health care isn’t going to be their top priority. Maybe on his last day in office GWB will give DeLay a pardon. I’m not sure what there is to fret about, our Republicans are left of JFK.

Alternative energy sources may hold over the US during the conflict. I am a proponent of too little too late than never at all. We don’t need to go off of the oil drug cold turkey, just long enough to wage WWIV.

3/15/2006 04:05:00 PM  
Blogger enscout said...

Russert used to be a stand-up guy. Never let anyone get away with a comment without having to defend it. Now he's just like all the others. Fell in love with his image.

3/15/2006 04:06:00 PM  
Blogger whit said...

Mexico claims a huge new oil find. Seeking funding to develop.

Back on thread:
BBC reports:
Abbas denounces Israeli jail raid

Mahmoud Abbas said Israel's raid on the Jericho jail was illegal
Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas has angrily denounced Israel's seizure of a leading militant from a West Bank jail.

Visiting the jail after cutting short a trip to Europe, Mr Abbas said Tuesday's raid was "an unforgivable crime" and a humiliation to the Palestinian people.

3/15/2006 04:09:00 PM  
Blogger whit said...


I think you give them way too much credit for self-control.

3/15/2006 04:12:00 PM  
Blogger enscout said...

We need to quit talking out both sides of our mouths on this issue of funding the sponsors of terror. Everyone knows who they are. They're the ones selling US all that oil.

Either we deal with the oil issue on the domestic front or deal with well funded enemies in the hot WOT front.

Pick your poison.

3/15/2006 04:12:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

The missing text: The PA's treatment of the assassins was ""an unforgivable crime" and a humiliation to the Palestinian people."

It is hard to humiliate someone who has beat you to it in every manner.

Somebody here had gotten it right, that the best weapon of the West is humiliation and shame. We need to up the tempo. Is anyone in this forum a good cartoonist?

3/15/2006 04:13:00 PM  
Blogger whit said...

Too many conservatives jumped on W when he said we were addicted to oil.

3/15/2006 04:15:00 PM  
Blogger blert said...

Cutting America off of economically competitive energy supplies: national suicide.

The only TRUE solution is to seize the oil fields. It solves the problem at a stroke.

Politically: not going to happen 'cause it's taboo.

3/15/2006 04:25:00 PM  
Blogger Karridine said...

Annoy Mouse: Cartoonist?

Check out BrainSurgeryWithSpoons.blogspot.com

and leave him some suggestions in Comments, for humiliating cartoons!

Grazi, Amigo!
Shukran, Sadiq!

3/15/2006 04:29:00 PM  
Blogger enscout said...


What about ANWAR, the Gulf of Mexico, Latin America. Until Chavez proves he's little more than an annoyance, we should be developing more domestic sources and shopping closer to home.

The situation is a national security issue. If the tree-hugger moonbats want to live in ANWAR, they should have a voice, otherwise, why are we paying this extremist minority any attention?

3/15/2006 04:35:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

I missed that fracas. We are addicted to oil. GWB is supposedly beholden to big oil so it surprised many Liberals. My Liberal friends made a stink because the Bush family and Cheney were involved in the oil industry. I countered that direct knowledge would allow more intelligent management. Would you want the CEO of a company (the President)to have no back ground in managment? If not you might as well hire a peanut farmer. OOps. Tried that.

They had the last laugh when Enron defrauded the state of California. Stay the course of course.

I saw a bit on 60 Minutes where the governor of Montana posited that we should convert coal into fuel.

"It’s not enough to completely break our addiction to foreign oil, but a start. Most coal today is used for electricity but the governor’s plan is to turn Montana’s billions of tons of untapped coal into a liquid diesel fuel for our cars. " CBSnews

WTF over.

That and nuclear, AWR, ethanol, and trading Mexican migrants for oil ought to do it. Let China dance the tango with Iran and Venezuela

It is a strategic concern and if Al Gore could solve it I'd be his hand-maiden. I'm voting security - energy independance - and national sovereignty, i.e. border control. Winner take all. I don't want to hear about style, beliefs, gonnas or wouldas, actions only will do, quit dithering.

3/15/2006 04:41:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

Karridine 4:29, et al,
You da man. I think it would make a great BC class project. I’ll tax my mind and try to dream up some juicy (not vulgar but pithy) vignettes. I would encourage anyone else so inclined to do the same. Maybe if we do our homework well and Wretchard approves, we can get some exposure here. Why should the Danes get all the credit?

3/15/2006 04:46:00 PM  
Blogger enscout said...

Thanks for the link. There are alternatives in the west that are largely untapped.

I spent time in ND when they were developing the coal fields there. They strip 20-30' of overburden (dirt) to get to a 10' seam of lignite. When they replace the overburden, the elevation comes right back to the original. No way they will compact it back as hard as the glaciers did.

The landscape was left in better shape than before. What was barren prarie was turned into a semi-wooded landscape.

There are ways to develop these resources without ruining the environs - despite what Ms Stahl & the save-the-whales crowd may think.

3/15/2006 04:59:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

Agree. We feed ourselves, we wouldn't consider letting others do it for us. Agriculture takes fuel, lots of it. Human dignity is at stake. environmentally, we have convinced ourselves that we don't want to pollute or show the influence of mankind anywhere. Praise Jesus and hand me a powercord, just don't locate your nukeler power plant in my backyard, hell, state. Give me crap built using lights out automation from China. No pollution right? Wrong. Follow the weather patterns, you can't say I am too anal to make a stink then buy garbage outright from China using low ages, no national let alone provincial EPA. No consumer demand. No democracy. The Greens are full of sh!t and even they know it. They just ply the lie maintaining plausibility that they are not commies. Let them live in their pristine communities, driving their Volvos in commune with the caribou just outside of the oil wells of ANWAR. Give them sumthin to snoot about.

3/15/2006 05:13:00 PM  
Blogger Karridine said...

Annoy Mouse: sounds like the start of something good!

I just posted my morning diatribe, today's being on "Irreconcilable Differences" between Hamas and Fatah.

Free for the downloading at:

And yes, come up with good japes, jibes, critical observations and satirical takes, but be assured: I will NOT DRAW crude, or sexual, or homocentric or ethnic slurring cartoons!

We want to criticize and satirize the thugs' ATTITUDES, not their skin-color.

3/15/2006 05:44:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

Right! The mind of our enemies are obscene enough. The world would be a more peaceful place if they could develop a sense of humor. Let us do our part and help them develop one.


3/15/2006 05:52:00 PM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

We have the comfort of knowing that liberalism is a dying ideology. Literally. Forty years of worshiping at the altars of abortion and homosexuality has predictably put the libs on the path to endangered species status. The next few election cycles are probably as close as they will come to the brass ring for several generations. Maybe that's the reason for the mean spirited desperation. They can sense the doom.

For the EUSSR it's even worse. The absolute preponderance of liberals puts the entire culture at risk of extinction.

3/15/2006 06:11:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

OT but Holy Mackerel! “Iraq’s Interior Minister Bayan Jabr revealed that Iraqi internal security had broken up a plot to place 421 al Qaeda fighters as guards controlling access to Baghdad’s International or “Green” Zone. Once in position, the terrorists planned to storm the U.S. and British embassies, take hostages, and wreak havoc. They were “one bureaucrat’s signature away” from implementing the plan when it was uncovered.” NRO They also have some great stuff on the Feingold fiasco.

How could 421 Al Queda be a signiture away from a job 'protecting'coalition forces? If this is true something stinks in Baghdad.

3/15/2006 06:31:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...


I just read an article on NRO about French college students who are protesting because a law is being enacted that will put them on an effective 2 year probation before they are guaranteed a job for life, regardless of performance. They have found a way of institutionalizing utter mediocrity. No wonder they resent us. People who compete make them look bad.

“only 13 percent of unemployed American workers couldn't find jobs in 12 months of looking. In France, 42 percent of unemployed workers couldn't find jobs within 12 months. (In Germany the number was 52 percent, and in Italy it was 50 percent.)” Yikes! I want to stay out of the way when that train wreck finally happens.

3/15/2006 06:40:00 PM  
Blogger Mətušélaḥ said...


3/15/2006 06:51:00 PM  
Blogger Buddy Larsen said...

Cartoons? Things like this are needed, to buttress the Wafa Sultans.

3/16/2006 11:27:00 AM  
Blogger Mətušélaḥ said...

I'm kinda partial to Liberal Larry's gentle progressyve wisdom. And I don't think he would approve that mentally challenged neofascist repunkkklikahn black and white clip that you've posted.

3/16/2006 07:58:00 PM  
Blogger Why Palestinians Usually Get It Wrong said...

Palestinians Humiliate Themselves

In a March 16 editorial in the New York Times titled, As If That Fire Needed Fuel, the Times writes:

"Israeli Army officials ordered inmates to strip to their underwear [see photo below], which many did, marching out with clothing on their heads, an embarrassing and completely unnecessary provocation that trampled the dignity of any Palestinian watching that spectacle.

Given the humiliations that ordinary Palestinians suffer merely by trying to get through Israeli checkpoints every day, the prison raid just reinforced the already degrading reality of living under foreign occupation."

Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas stated, “What happened without a doubt is an ugly crime which can not be forgiven and a humiliation for the Palestinian people.”

Palesinians should feel humiliated. A majority of Palestinians living in the West Bank, Gaza, and Jerusalem support suicide terrorism. A 2001 poll by Dr. Nabil Kukali and the Palestinian Center for Public Opinion (PCPO), found, "a substantial majority [of Palestinians] (76.1%) support suicidal attacks like that of Netanya [in May, 2001], whereas 12.5% oppose, and 11.4% express no opinion." A 2006 poll taken by the Jerusalem Media & Communication Center after the recent Hamas political victories found, “56.2% [of Palestinians] strongly or somewhat support suicide bombing operations against Israeli civilians whereas 40.7% oppose such operations.”

Considering that the majority of Palestinians support suicide terror, and considering that Israel prevents suicide killings on a daily basis, it should come as no surprise that captured Palestinians are asked to remove their clothes during the process of incarceration. Why should any Israeli take a chance of being blown up? Why should Israel present Palestinians with opportunities to commit suicide killings?

Palestinians should feel humiliated about their culture of death and they should be asked to strip naked during the process of incarceration as long as their population continues to support, condone, and commit suicide killings.



3/17/2006 05:39:00 PM  

Post a Comment

Links to this post:

Create a Link

<< Home

Powered by Blogger