Friday, January 27, 2006

Money for nothin' and chicks for free

Whatever happens the "International Community" has to keep on supplying money to Hamas for whatever purposes Hamas intends to use it. Jimmy Carter and the Guardian have already made the argument.

  • Carter, who led an 85-member international observer team from around the world organized by the 'National Democratic Institute' in partnership with 'The Carter Center,' urged the international community to directly or indirectly fund the new Palestinian Government even though it will be led by an internationally-declared foreign terror organization. "The Palestinian Government is destitute, and in desperate financial straits. I hope that support for the new government will be forthcoming," Carter said at a Jerusalem press conference. -- Jerusalem Post 
  • Any cut-off in EU aid would only be a gift to Israel's hardliners. The EU is the largest international donor to the Palestinian Authority, and Javier Solana, the EU foreign policy chief, blundered last month when he told a Gaza press conference that "it would be very difficult for the help and the money that goes to the Palestinian Authority to continue to flow" if Hamas were in government. ... Above all, Europe should not get hung up on the wrong issues, like armed resistance and the "war on terror". -- Tony Steele in the Guardian

Even Israel is expected to keep the money flowing.

  • Israel could plunge the Palestinian Authority into a financial crisis by withholding its main source of income, following the election victory by the militant group Hamas, Israeli officials warned yesterday ... Speaking in Davos, Mazen Sinokrot, the Palestinian economics minister, urged Israel to maintain its financial ties with the PA. "Israel has always been our major trading partner. I'm sure the Israelis with their wise approach will look at it in a very positive way and will not try to tackle any incorrect issues when it comes to the collection of revenues," he said. --- News - International

The United States, the EU, Israel and the United Nations are expected to keep dishing out the money and "not get hung up on the wrong issues, like armed resistance and the 'war on terror'"


Two posts back, on January 26, I predicted this would happen once people got up the gumption to stick out their hands. But I thought the interval would be more decent.

The relationship between the West and the Palestinian proto-state has been unnatural in that it paid or supplied most of the services that the Palestinian state ought to have provided in the first place. This not only contributed to corruption but relieved the Palestinian political parties of the burden of good governance. It was never necessary to collect garbage or build roads and the political parties were free, like teenagers supported by indulgent parents, to leave their rooms dirty while they raised hell.

Now some will argue that the Palestinian Authority was in no position to do this due to Israeli occupation. But now that they've got some territory and a government that excuse will be thin.

More is expected of America than to "do business" with the PA in the same way it does with other countries. It will not be enough to desist from invasion and to observe international usages. What is expected is to keep paying their bills.

I think the implicit expectation will be to keep the money -- a.k.a. the peace process -- flowing to Hamas. Failure to do this will be described as "punishing the Palestinians" for exercising their democratic rights. But where is it written that one country must underwrite another?

It wasn't a difficult prediction to make. Only five months ago during the unilateral withdrawal from Gaza the United Nations saw its way clear to support those jeering the Israelis out. The New York Sun reported:

The United Nations bankrolled the production of thousands of banners, bumper stickers, mugs, and T-shirts bearing the slogan "Today Gaza and Tomorrow the West Bank and Jerusalem," which have been widely distributed to Palestinian Arabs in the Gaza Strip, according to a U.N. official.

"Today Gaza and Tomorrow the West Bank and Jerusalem". Now who said something like that before? This is the way the West may end, not with a mighty clash of arms, but in shame. In deserved shame.


Blogger Richard said...

All that is needed is for Hamas to provide the fig leaf of a sham Sinn Fein/IRA split and the usual suspects will gladly give it credence so the charade can continue.

1/27/2006 09:13:00 PM  
Blogger Charles said...

OT:imho its always a good idea to keep a weather eye on the physicists.
Sonofusion Experiment Produces Results Without External Neutron Source
January 27, 2006
A team of researchers from Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, Purdue University, and the Russian Academy of Sciences has used sound waves to induce nuclear fusion without the need for an external neutron source, according to a paper in the Jan. 27 issue of Physical Review Letters.

1/27/2006 09:38:00 PM  
Blogger Anointiata Delenda Est said...

Perhaps Hamas will have more to worry about than organising garbage collection for its constituents:

Hamas, whose shock parliamentary election victory changed the face of Palestinian politics, said it would soon hold talks with President Mahmoud Abbas on ‘political partnership’.

But Fatah leaders have rejected a coalition with Hamas and thousands of Fatah supporters, firing into the air, marched in the Gaza Strip in protest at the idea. Thousands of Hamas backers celebrated their victory in separate rallies.

The Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades, part of Fatah, issued a statement threatening to ‘liquidate’ the faction’s leaders if they changed their minds and joined a Hamas-led administration.
- Reuters, more (car burning, etc) here.

Could it be possible that the International Community will be supporting both sides in a civil war?


1/27/2006 09:48:00 PM  
Blogger Dan said...

The big difference I see between the PA and Iraq or Afghanistan is Hamas is a popular government so toppling the regime won’t solve many problems they will need the fight beaten out of them.

1/27/2006 09:50:00 PM  
Blogger Charles said...

In many ways people conform to the way they make their living.

If they have to put on a buffelo skin to hunt a buffelo or zebra skin to hunt a zebra--well then that's what they do. If they have to light fires and wave animal skins to drive beasts over cliffs then that's what they do. If they have to hoe the ground to plant grain or potatoes then that's what they do. If they have to get in a boat to spear the leviathan then that's what they do. If they have to hang motionless over the water with a spear....

I think that its a helpful exercise to understand the confusion of money that has poured into palestinian coffers for decades from the europeans the arabs the US. No wonder the poor palestinians have been spearing potatoes and digging up wildabeasts.

Perhaps, Hamas can force an end to European, american and israeli contributions to the palestinian economy -- and thereby bring some clarity to the way those people live.

1/27/2006 10:26:00 PM  
Blogger gumshoe1 said...

sharon may be out,
but i'd say he's not out of the picture.

i'd even say he saw this coming.

that the global press is "stunned"
by the election outcome is,imo,
simply evidence that they've
abandoned their better instincts
and judgement.

1/27/2006 10:37:00 PM  
Blogger Ð”dαm Ŧhε Mαd said...

Dan -
Or, as ADE states, the PA's need to take each other out. It's like one commentator in the 80's said that the solution to LA's gang problem was to invite one another to the Coliseum, hand out one handgun each, and let 'em have at it.

In the PA's case, Sharon's plan for boxing them in is playing out so far. It's only a matter of time before they are at each other's throats.

I fail to see a better outcome for the PA/Israel situation. The Israelis can't be blamed for a damn thing, and the PA's who 'love death' hitch a ride with the Pale Horseman.

The morning a-hole on LA, KABC radio was attempting at some kind vague reproach for Bush-supporters by saying repeatedly, "Be careful what you wish for," as if the Hamas involvement in the election was not anticipated.

He went on for a good two hours snarking like a snotnosed 7-year-old, "be careful what you wish for" again and again, but couldn't face the simple facts:

1. Israel faces the lowest number of attacks in years.
2. A majority that will fight the PA civil war are those whose murderous ideology leaves no room for compromise or the ability to make peace. Those that wanted peace and properity left.
3. Israel innocent of the deaths in a PA civil war. Only the most terminally anti-semitic of the world would accuse Isreal of causing murderers to kill one another.

I fail to see any downside. If the neighborhood wacko burns down his own house, it takes a spiteful cynic to find the negative.

1/27/2006 10:54:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

"that the global press is "stunned" by the election outcome is,imo, simply evidence that they've abandoned their better instincts and udgement" gumshoe,
They quickly regained their balance, however, and are now all on the same page, i.e.
"The responsibility that comes with power will cause Hamas to moderate their stands."

1/27/2006 11:04:00 PM  
Blogger Mətušélaḥ said...

Debka is reporting that "the Fatah-al Aqsa Brigades of the Gaza Strip announced Tuesday, Jan. 24, receipt of a new surface missile, designated No. 207, whose 27- kilometer range covers the entire district of the Israeli port of Ashkelon." In addition to the port, the city of Ashkelon houses a large oil depot, a major electrical plant, and the world's largest water desalination plant.

1/27/2006 11:08:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

Michael Herzog disagrees w/MSM: Can Hamas Be Tamed?
Optimists argue that Hamas' participation in mainstream Palestinian politics will spur the group to moderate its radical goals and terrorist tactics. But history shows that political participation co-opts militants only under very specific conditions -- and almost none of those exist in the Palestinian Authority today.

1/27/2006 11:14:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

More from the man of Steele:
" Murdering a Palestinian politician by a long-range attack that is bound also to kill innocent civilians is morally and legally no better than a suicide bomb on a bus.
Hamas's refusal to give formal recognition of Israel's right to exist should also not be seen by Europe as an urgent problem
. History and international politics do not march in tidy simultaneous steps.

Hamas may eventually disarm itself and recognise Israel. That will be the end of the process of establishing a just modus vivendi for Israelis and Palestinians in the Middle East. It cannot be the first step. Today's priority is to accept that Palestinians have spoken freely.
They deserve respect and support.

1/27/2006 11:23:00 PM  
Blogger gumshoe1 said...

"I fail to see any downside. If the neighborhood wacko burns down his own house, it takes a spiteful cynic to find the negative."

downside is he wants a new house.
or to move into yours.

1/27/2006 11:25:00 PM  
Blogger Annoy Mouse said...

It was interesting to watch the Palestinians celebrate the election victory, raised fists and grimacing expressions of maniacal splendor. It scenes like these or when we see an infant dressed with a mock suicide belt, one can presume that they do not celebrate Halloween in Palestine but live it in a macabre sense. I think western democracies owe it to Palestine the chance to renounce their stated goals. Perhaps in the spirit of politics they promised more than they can or intend to deliver. But if they hold to the old line of reasoning, no quarter to be given until Israel has been wiped from the map, let the Arabs pay their bills. The money the EU donates to Palestine only makes it easier to use Arab money to fund terror activities. Consider that if all Hamas wants is “Today Gaza, tommorow the West Bank and Jeruselem”, then the Europeans will help them get it. If they demand the destruction of Israel, they will be censored. Such is the limp slap of multiculturalism.

A little Hamas punch:
There is no solution to the Palestinian problem except by Jihad.
The initiatives, proposals and International Conferences are but a waste
of time, an exercise in futility. The Palestinian people are too noble
to have their future, their right and their destiny submitted to a vain
game. As the Hadith has it:

"The people of Syria are Allah's whip on this land; He takes
revenge by their intermediary from whoever he wishes among his
worshippers. The Hypocrites among them are forbidden from
vanquishing the true believers, and they will die in anxiety and

Jimmy Carter is at his best when he is urging Europeans to step into the breach of self-destruction. I sometimes wonder if this man hasn’t lived in shame for so long that he is channeling a the tortured soul of Zippy the Pinhead.

1/27/2006 11:31:00 PM  
Blogger Doug said...

" The EU is the largest international donor to the Palestinian Authority "
Timmerman points out that we should not forget that Iran helpfully chips in $100 million a year to Hamas.
He says their charter was written in the good old USA by some green card holders.
"Our Strenght is Our Diversity"tm

1/27/2006 11:33:00 PM  
Blogger Spag-oz said...

So now that Hamas is in control of the purse strings the corruption will cease and all the aid will go to those who deserve it? And pigs can fly!!!

For the donor countries to keep the flow of money going at the same rate as before would be like giving the fox an open gate to the chicken coop. How many new 3rd world governments have slipped into the same mould as their predecessors when they suddenly become the "haves". How long will it be before the word corruption is a tag on the Hamas government.

1/27/2006 11:46:00 PM  
Blogger Mətušélaḥ said...

" The EU is the largest international donor to the Palestinian Authority "

Israel is probably a close second.

1/27/2006 11:55:00 PM  
Blogger Das said...

The Palestinian love affair with the Impossible has come to and end. Palestinians were mezmerized by the-never-to-be; the suicide bombings were just the cherry on top; they were having the time of their lives, blowing things and people sky high and into the next life ( I used to love those explanations by liberals of why suicide bombing was a natural response to despair - yeah, poor despairing youth, along with an entire mini-industry of twisted imams and bomb dressers). Don't give me that despair crap.

Now Palestinians are faced with the awful boredom of the possible, the do-able. Will they cut it? Putting one foot in front of the other, lights, water, roads - all the tedium of hum-drum things that all serious societies get down to doing. Suicide bombing is a kind of addiction (as is the love of nothing - nihilism); wll they be able to kick it?

1/28/2006 01:42:00 AM  
Blogger Karridine said...

"The responsibility that comes with power will cause Hamas to moderate their stands."

Doug, was THIS a real quote from some commentator?

With a CHARTER that sidesteps responsibility, and leaders that deny responsibility, and followers eager to be told that they're not responsible, and DECADES of enforced non-responsibility, Zippy stood up for the record and said, "The responsibility that comes with power will cause Hamas to moderate their stands."

ROFLMAO! Bizarre dysjunction! Un-fletching-real!

1/28/2006 02:50:00 AM  
Blogger desert rat said...

Out of the frying pan, into the fire

1/28/2006 02:57:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

The only difference between Hamas and the PLO is that is that Arafat and his cronies were better cross-dressers. The EU weenies will still send flowers and pick up the tab for dinner. They just can't pretend they didn't know any longer.

1/28/2006 03:06:00 AM  
Blogger Anointiata Delenda Est said...

Adam the Mad writes
A majority that will fight the PA civil war are those whose murderous ideology leaves no room for compromise or the ability to make peace.

Let's not forget the Fatah boys who were on the take (only mug punters believe in religion as a motivator for death). They'll be packing some heat now the gravy train's no longer a'coming - worse, possibly shunted to a clan that your clan has hated for the last 3000 years. Same conclusion though, no room for compromise or the ability to make peace.




1/28/2006 03:14:00 AM  
Blogger Starling David Hunter said...

Given the propensity of the West and its institutions to bankroll the Palestinian authority, the likelihood they will do the same when Hamas takes power, along with their tendency to require little in return for their largesse, I would have thought the title of this post would have been "Money for nothin' and your checks for free." ;-)

1/28/2006 04:17:00 AM  
Blogger NN said...

With history book in hand, 1930s appeasement may seem inconceivable. We are repeating the same mistakes however. And if you ever wondered in what kind of culture the Holocaust took place, you need only look around to get a feel of it.

"The Palestinians have a right to vote and we must respect their decision. Hamas will restore law and order and that is a good thing. Besides, they have suffered so much, their treatment of the Jews is understandable, now I don't support it, mind you ..." etc.

No, we are not facing "bands of sturdy Teutonic youth ... with the light of desire to suffer for the Fatherland ..." (Churchill), but "thousands of the Islamic nation's youths who are eager to die just as the Americans are eager to live." I submit that the difference is, ultimately, of little importance.

When and where will it end?

1/28/2006 05:01:00 AM  
Blogger whit said...

GAZA, Jan. 26, 2006 — - Mariam Farahat, who was elected to the Palestinian parliament, can work a crowd like a veteran politician -- shaking hands and greeting supporters. When she gets on the stage at a Hamas rally, she is the star attraction. She was one of Hamas' most popular candidates in Wednesday's election.
In Gaza, Farahat is known as Um Nidal, or Mother of the Struggle -- a mother who sent three of her six sons on Hamas suicide missions against Israeli targets.
"We consider it holy duty," she told ABC News. "Our land is occupied. You take all the means to banish the occupier. I sacrificed my children for this holy, patriotic duty. I love my children, but as Muslims we pressure ourselves and sacrifice our emotions for the interest of the homeland. The greater interest takes precedence to the personal interest."
She is most famous for her presence in a Hamas video, showing her 17-year-old how to attack Israelis and telling him not to return. Shortly afterward, he killed five students in a Jewish settlement before he was killed himself.
Um Nidal's home has become a shrine to her dead sons, with admirers and other members of Hamas often dropping by.

1/28/2006 05:02:00 AM  
Blogger Tom Paine said...

People focus too much on Hamas, Fatah, Likud, Labor, etc.

The Paletinian-Israeli conflict continues primarily because the wider Arab world *wants* it to continue. (As a distraction.)

Thus, the other Arabs send money, weapons, terrorists, and most of all, INCITEMENT, to keep the pot boiling -- and they will continue to do so because they don’t really give a damn who runs the PA.

Palestinian leaders (no matter who they might be) could only get themselves assasinated trying to resist this flood – and not one of them is about to risk that.

Bush has known these facts since 2001 (and Sharon came to know them) – which is why Bush is using American power to force political change on the entire region (and why Sharon built his wall to better wait for Bush’s changes to take hold).

Islamic fascism is a philosophy/attitude that infests every country in the M.E. and totally controlled (as of 2001) the governments of about six of them. As of 2006, three of these countries, (Afghanistan, Iraq, Lebanon). have been moved, primarily by American action, into the democracy column – and these countries no longer send money, weapons, terrorists, or incitement to Palestine.

Bush will remove the Iranian regime before the end of his term. (Syria is a rotten fruit that will fall on it’s own shortly after that.)

This will leave only Saudi Arabia and Egypt to for Hillary to deal with, assuming she “gets it” by then (likely, but not assured). McCain, Giuliani, and most of the other Republicans already get it.

1/28/2006 05:33:00 AM  
Blogger nonomous said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

1/28/2006 05:39:00 AM  
Blogger PeterBoston said...

In Gaza, Farahat is known as Um Nidal, or Mother of the Struggle -- a mother who sent three of her six sons on Hamas suicide missions against Israeli targets.

The only cash crop the Palestinians have harvested for 50 years is their own children. The most vile and contemptible collection of human detritus on earth. No apologies.

1/28/2006 05:41:00 AM  
Blogger 2164th said...

This is a real opportunity for the Palestinians to learn a basic civics lesson. It is also an opportunity for the little fool Jimmy Carter to close his ample mouth, but my money is that neither will rise to the occasion.

1/28/2006 07:36:00 AM  
Blogger ed said...


If America continues to give money to the PA after Hamas's victory then America deserves everything that happens afterwards.

1/28/2006 07:45:00 AM  
Blogger Mətušélaḥ said...

Breaking News:

JPOST is reporting that according to the former deputy of the Iraqi air force, General Georges Sada, former dictator of Iraq, Saddam Hussein, ordered him to bomb Israeli population centers with chemical weapons during the first Gulf War.
Sada also claims that Iraq's chemical weapons were taken to Syria aboard civilian Iraqi "Boeing" airplanes just prior to the US invasion.. 56 flights of this type took place, but went largely unnoticed because they were flying under the guise of humanitarian aid.

1/28/2006 08:14:00 AM  
Blogger diabeticfriendly said...

this thread will not have legs, since already new topics have posted..

in the news today, iran has threatened use of rockets for "british" aid to insurgents in IRAN!

Look for an exciting few months...

personally, i cant wait for gaza to burn, and all NOT israel's problem, look to the poison spreading to jordan and egypt and their muslim brotherhood co-nazis...

yes, virginia there is a santa claus!

pass the pork rinds, the games are about to start!

1/28/2006 08:53:00 AM  
Blogger The Anti-Jihadist said...

Asking Israel to keep funding the "Palestinian Government" is like asking a battered wife to keep sending her violent ex husband spousal support.

1/28/2006 09:03:00 AM  
Blogger The Fox said...

Financial support of a Palestine controlled by Hamas is aid that will be used to carry out terrorism, including the murder of Israeli civilians. Therefore, Europe and the U.S. must end financial support now.

Iran, Syria, and the oil-rich Arab states will likely step into the financial breach created by the exit of Western aid. Let them use up their resources to prop up Hamas.

1/28/2006 09:52:00 AM  
Blogger diabeticfriendly said...

Let them use up their resources to prop up Hamas.

come on, we have been stupid...

the oil crisis has DOUBLED the cost of gas in the last 13 months...

this translates into:

The combination of relatively high oil prices and exports led to a revenues windfall for Saudi Arabia during 2004 and early 2005. For 2004 as a whole, Saudi Arabia earned about $116 billion in net oil export revenues


116 BILLION....

1/28/2006 10:05:00 AM  
Blogger diabeticfriendly said...

sorry, of the 116 BILLION only about 1/3 was the windfall...

I do apoligize...

40 billion.. is not really alot of extra cash to support jew hating murderers

1/28/2006 10:06:00 AM  
Blogger diabeticfriendly said...

think of this fact, while most of humanity WORKS TO MAKE A LIVING, the opec countries grossed 490 BILLION a year for doing NOTHING cept squatting on the right piece of land.

Since the world poor takes the price of oil in the ass, why is not the world's poor not pissed at opec, rather than the usa?

1/28/2006 10:30:00 AM  
Blogger diabeticfriendly said...

The Palestinians are about to elect Hitler.

pass the porkrinds

1/28/2006 10:33:00 AM  
Blogger diabeticfriendly said...

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip - Following their resounding election victory, the Islamic militants of Hamas met the question of whether they will change their stripes with a loud "no": no recognition of Israel, no negotiations, no renunciation of terror

and this is different from 1967?

Khartoum summit: the three Arab no's against Israel

31. Resolution adopted at the Arab Summit Conference in Khartoum, 1 September 1967.

(1) The conference has affirmed the unity of Arab ranks, the unity of joint action and the need for co-ordination and for the elimination of all differences.
The Kings, Presidents and representatives of the other Arab Heads of State at the conference have affirmed their countries' stand by and implementation of the Arab Solidarity Charter which was signed at the third Arab summit conference in Casablanca.

(2) The conference has agreed on the need to consolidate all efforts to eliminate the effects of the aggression on the basis that the occupied lands are Arab lands and that the burden of regaining these lands falls on all the Arab States.

(3) The Arab Heads of State have agreed to unite their political efforts at the international and diplomatic level to eliminate the effects of the aggression and to ensure the withdrawal of the aggressive Israeli forces from the Arab lands which have been occupied since the aggression of 5 June. This will be done within the framework of the main principles by which the Arab States abide, namely, no peace with Israel, no recognition of Israel, no negotiations with it, and insistence on the rights of the Palestinian people in their own country.

1/28/2006 10:54:00 AM  
Blogger whit said...

Pork Rinds:
Since the world poor takes the price of oil in the ass, why is not the world's poor not pissed at opec, rather than the usa?
You just asked the question that seques to the next post.

1/28/2006 10:57:00 AM  
Blogger rasqual said...

"The funeral baked meats did coldly furnish forth the marriage tables."

1/28/2006 02:35:00 PM  
Blogger Red A said...

Certainly, if we don't wish to support Hamas we should not.

To provide cover, I'd reduce Israel's support as well. The country is a wealthy industrialized nation. It doesn't really need 6 billion a year in aid.

(same arguments applied as you applied to letting the Pals stand on their own.)

We will keep up the moral and diplomatic support of course.

1/28/2006 08:08:00 PM  
Blogger Ozymandias said...

Alright, please explain to me why we are giving money to the Palestinians, either directly or by giving money to the Israelis to re-gift. (Why do we even call them Palestinians when they're mostly Egyptians and Jordanians, but that's another discussion.) Why do we give the Israelis money to protect themselves from the Palestinian depredations that we financed in the first place? I don't understand why we're paying to maintain such a perverse situation.

Stop all Western aid of any kind to the Palestinians, and do it now. Maybe their Arab brethren will pick up the slack and nothing will change except that we save some money and have less blood on our hands. More likely, the Arab world will demonstrate indifference to the Palestinian cause, and the Palestinians will very quickly face a choice: starve, become Mad Max, or move away. Those that remain and survive will have to prioritize between providing basic services like sanitation and potable water and whipping Qasam rockets at the Israelis.

The first few months or years would be Hobbesian, but, ultimately, how cruel and bloody is continuing the status quo? What are we accomplishing by protecting these people from their own decisions? Is their culture worth preserving, or is it doomed to bloody implosion sooner or later anyway?

These people cheered on 9/11. I say cut 'em loose. Triage this culture into the dead pile and direct our resources where they might do some good.

1/28/2006 11:18:00 PM  
Blogger GaijinBiker said...

I see some upside here. Based on your post title, Hamas appears to be in dire straits.

1/29/2006 03:57:00 AM  
Blogger Dan said...

Дdαm Ŧhε Mαd –

“Goyim kill goyim, and they blame the Jews!”
Israeli Prime Minister, Menachem Begin

1/29/2006 12:44:00 PM  

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